Intex saltwater water system salt ppm woes and general Rust prevention questions?

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Re: Intex saltwater water system + ultra frame 18 by 52 bad for rust? Prevention?

If you've only used 3 1/2 pucks to chlorinate over a two week period, algae could be starting to form. (It can eat up FC before you actually see it.) is it the TF100 you have? If so, you should perform an Pool School - Perform the Overnight FC Loss Test (OCLT) using bleach or liquid chlorine, pucks out, SWG off, using the FAS-DPD chlorine test.
 
Re: Intex saltwater water system + ultra frame 18 by 52 bad for rust? Prevention?

PAGirl said:
If you've only used 3 1/2 pucks to chlorinate over a two week period, algae could be starting to form. (It can eat up FC before you actually see it.) is it the TF100 you have? If so, you should perform an Pool School - Perform the Overnight FC Loss Test (OCLT) using bleach or liquid chlorine, pucks out, SWG off, using the FAS-DPD chlorine test.
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I have the TF100..

I used the blue box.. put the R-0600 in the left (yellow) and the R-0014 in the right.. is this Chlorine but not FC? Confused on that part, because on the back of the guide paper it came with, it says to do the R-0870 powder then 0871 till clear etc and record as FC, i'm assuming this is FC and the number we are really after?

Should the blue test kit chlorine value be 2 ppm or higher and the FC be above 5 ppm?

For this overnight test, how much bleach / chlorox do i put in? I have liquid bleach (concentrated) handy, but maybe 8-10 oz left in a bottle, how much do i add.. do i add this amount first (whatever the amount is), wait 30 minutes one evening and then record the values.. then first thing in morning record again and hope for a drop of less than 1 ? I also have a 1lb bag of shock on hand (mostly chlorine i think, maybe 80% or higher, which i have not used yet).

Also.. the ph being around 7.2, but "chlorine" being zero right now, with mostly clear water, some debris needs vacuumed on bottom.. would it technically still be safe to swim for the time being I assume?

Is it likely that this low FC or Chlorine level has something to do with the 4.5 bags of 40lbs of salt not being above 500 ppm so far for the swg and with the strip test?

Thanks again
 
Re: Intex saltwater water system + ultra frame 18 by 52 bad for rust? Prevention?

theskyisthelimit99 said:
I have the TF100..

I used the blue box.. put the R-0600 in the left (yellow) and the R-0014 in the right.. is this Chlorine but not FC? Confused on that part, because on the back of the guide paper it came with, it says to do the R-0870 powder then 0871 till clear etc and record as FC, i'm assuming this is FC and the number we are really after?

Should the blue test kit chlorine value be 2 ppm or higher and the FC be above 5 ppm?

For this overnight test, how much bleach / chlorox do i put in? I have liquid bleach (concentrated) handy, but maybe 8-10 oz left in a bottle, how much do i add.. do i add this amount first (whatever the amount is), wait 30 minutes one evening and then record the values.. then first thing in morning record again and hope for a drop of less than 1 ? I also have a 1lb bag of shock on hand (mostly chlorine i think, maybe 80% or higher, which i have not used yet).

Also.. the ph being around 7.2, but "chlorine" being zero right now, with mostly clear water, some debris needs vacuumed on bottom.. would it technically still be safe to swim for the time being I assume?

Is it likely that this low FC or Chlorine level has something to do with the 4.5 bags of 40lbs of salt not being above 500 ppm so far for the swg and with the strip test?

Thanks again
Click to expand...

Here are the extended directions for the FAS-DPD Test Pool School - FAS-DPD Chlorine Test

I'm not sure about the testing for the salt, when I use pool math to calculate what the salt would be in a 6900 gallon pool if you add 4 1/2 bags (180#) I get 3100 ppm. Even just 1 bag would raise it 693 ppm. Perhaps there is a different calculation needed to read the salt test?

I would do the OCLT tomorrow night, if possible. It will tell you if it's a possibility that your SWG is indeed roducing chlorine and the chlorine is being used up quickly by algae. (A real possibility if your FC has been at zero often.)
 
Seeing the SWG isn't saying low or high salt then maybe you are actually in the range. I assume it has run, just turning it on does not make it run. When the SWG is running you would see tiny bubbles coming from the return. If you were to test with OTO using that water you should see the chlorine as higher than the rest of the pool. I would keep testing the water for salt with the strips you have, try some water from deeper in the pool. I would also get some liquid bleach so you can get the chlorine level in the 10 range after dark and then see what you have for FC and CC in the morning using the powder test (FAS-DPD). You really want to maintain some FC all day, the number depends on your CYA level. I like to keep mine around 4ppm when running the SWG.
 
MikeInNH said:
Seeing the SWG isn't saying low or high salt then maybe you are actually in the range. I assume it has run, just turning it on does not make it run. When the SWG is running you would see tiny bubbles coming from the return. If you were to test with OTO using that water you should see the chlorine as higher than the rest of the pool. I would keep testing the water for salt with the strips you have, try some water from deeper in the pool. I would also get some liquid bleach so you can get the chlorine level in the 10 range after dark and then see what you have for FC and CC in the morning using the powder test (FAS-DPD). You really want to maintain some FC all day, the number depends on your CYA level. I like to keep mine around 4ppm when running the SWG.
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I was trying to figure out based on say 7000 gallon how much bleach to add to the pool, if infact the FC is zero/ CYA is not right too etc.. the pool calculator for some reason eludes me on here, newbie i guess. So i guess i need to add some till the chlorine test (not fc?) hits 10, then check in the morning.. guessing several small jugs of it maybe (still need to figure that out).

I turned on the intex swg before, ran it for 4 hours.. i basically turned it on, set the timer for 4 hours.. i did notice there was a boost button, but i havent gotten that far yet.

So in theory, if its producing chlorine, i should capture some water at the return point and see if chlorine is above zero here (but after how long from the time its turned on i wonder).. ill check for bubbles too.
 
The calculator is pretty easy once you figure it out. The top 2 rows are your concern right now. Put your pool size in gallons in the left orange box. Then in the left yellow boxes you put the current FC number in the first box and the target in the 2nd. Hit the calculate button and you will see it will tell you 107 ounces of 8% bleach for a 7k pool going from 0 FC to 10. Eventually you will get to know what your pool takes for dosages. In the beginning it helps to write them down.

http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html
 
We have a 16' x 48" Intex Ultra w/SWG and I run ours for at least 6 hrs a day. 4 hrs is not enough to keep the chlorine up IMO. Plus, if you haven't added any bleach or chlorine, I'd bet you are way low. The SWG will maintain a chlorine level once set right, but you have to provide enough chlorine to keep it stable until the SWG can do its job. Don't ask how I know....
 
CR172 said:
We have a 16' x 48" Intex Ultra w/SWG and I run ours for at least 6 hrs a day. 4 hrs is not enough to keep the chlorine up IMO. Plus, if you haven't added any bleach or chlorine, I'd bet you are way low. The SWG will maintain a chlorine level once set right, but you have to provide enough chlorine to keep it stable until the SWG can do its job. Don't ask how I know....
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True statement.
 
Thanks for the tips on the calculator and swg..

I was able to retest some things..

Yesterday the pool was still visibly ok, clear mostly, no slime on the walls, no green etc..

Today however things got worse.. clearly it was in need of the chlorine/bleach.. i ran some measurements using the tf100.. cya is at zero (black dot never disappeared).. FC was at zero.

Prior to doing anything i checked the sand filter.. i forgot to check the glass tube for dirt/sand in it.. i had ignored it not noticing it was probably filled with dirt/brown.. but i went ahead and did a backflush.. maybe 45 seconds or so on the intex sand pump (2800 gal/hr).. i waited till the brown water became clearer then did a rinse for maybe 30 seconds.. at this point i remembered i was to check the glass tube.. it still has a slight amount of debris in it, not that much. The pressure gauge had never got to the orange level even before this.. levels were the same before and after.. however.. the return valve was spewing out at a normal rate, visible now, more suction on the intakes too (was barely any).. it had been about 2.5 weeks since setting up the pool, where i started with one 3" tab in the filter basket initially, then when it vanished i put 2 in the chlorine floater till they were 25% gone and installed the swg and had only ran it for 4 hours to date..

Clearly out of chlorine, my fault for not keeping up with the tests..


At this point it was too late to run and get bleach.. so i opted to use the poolife 78% ca hypo i had on hand.. bag says use 9-16oz (16oz = full bag) for 10,000 gallon.. i decided to dump the whole thing in.

Went out about 2 hours later.. wall still slimy (but i'm guessing that could take a day or more to clear and/or more bleach/shock)..

Ran the tests. FC took 36 drops.. FC is now reading 18 (the intex test strip i have on hand seems to show 10, it also shows alk at around or below 40 and maybe ph at 6.2, acidic)..

I think at this point i need CYA, and to boost the ph (baking soda?), saturday i have a better salt tester coming.. i think it will show normal levels (kids in pool said pool seemed salty) and probably at that point ill run the sand filter and swg for 6 hours a day at the same time.

Either way i'm learning how to use the tf100 kit.. liking its better accuracy and its not too hard to do.
 
theskyisthelimit99 said:
Thanks for the tips on the calculator and swg..

I was able to retest some things..

Yesterday the pool was still visibly ok, clear mostly, no slime on the walls, no green etc..

Today however things got worse.. clearly it was in need of the chlorine/bleach.. i ran some measurements using the tf100.. cya is at zero (black dot never disappeared).. FC was at zero.

Prior to doing anything i checked the sand filter.. i forgot to check the glass tube for dirt/sand in it.. i had ignored it not noticing it was probably filled with dirt/brown.. but i went ahead and did a backflush.. maybe 45 seconds or so on the intex sand pump (2800 gal/hr).. i waited till the brown water became clearer then did a rinse for maybe 30 seconds.. at this point i remembered i was to check the glass tube.. it still has a slight amount of debris in it, not that much. The pressure gauge had never got to the orange level even before this.. levels were the same before and after.. however.. the return valve was spewing out at a normal rate, visible now, more suction on the intakes too (was barely any).. it had been about 2.5 weeks since setting up the pool, where i started with one 3" tab in the filter basket initially, then when it vanished i put 2 in the chlorine floater till they were 25% gone and installed the swg and had only ran it for 4 hours to date..

Clearly out of chlorine, my fault for not keeping up with the tests..


At this point it was too late to run and get bleach.. so i opted to use the poolife 78% ca hypo i had on hand.. bag says use 9-16oz (16oz = full bag) for 10,000 gallon.. i decided to dump the whole thing in.

Went out about 2 hours later.. wall still slimy (but i'm guessing that could take a day or more to clear and/or more bleach/shock)..

Ran the tests. FC took 36 drops.. FC is now reading 18 (the intex test strip i have on hand seems to show 10, it also shows alk at around or below 40 and maybe ph at 6.2, acidic)..

I think at this point i need CYA, and to boost the ph (baking soda?), saturday i have a better salt tester coming.. i think it will show normal levels (kids in pool said pool seemed salty) and probably at that point ill run the sand filter and swg for 6 hours a day at the same time.

Either way i'm learning how to use the tf100 kit.. liking its better accuracy and its not too hard to do.
Click to expand...
Your pH reading will not be reliable with a FC above 10.

And you definitely need some CYA in your pool, or you'll continue dropping to zero FC without constant attention. Don't overshoot, though. Bring the CYA up in steps.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
 

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Re: Intex saltwater water system + ultra frame 18 by 52 bad for rust? Prevention?

theskyisthelimit99 said:
This pool holds 6900 or so i think.. i think the value in the manual said around 170lbs.. i forget.. when i tested i just took a cup and scooped off the top (both times).. i had just got those strips off amazon, maybe i should order the drop kit for salt testing instead, yeah its $26 but maybe the numbers would come out differently.. the swg unit never said low or high salt either when i did run it.

I also used the 100 test kit and tested the chlorine.. its showing "clear", i guess none? (eek).. but the ph is 7.2.. perhaps this is also a factor.
Click to expand...

According to pool math, your pool hold aprox. 7600 gals. I used 4ft as the depth. I believe this is where some folks go astray. The pool is 52" tall, but the water is only about 46 - 48" deep. Our pool is 48" tall but I use 42" for my calculations.
 
911medic said:
Your pH reading will not be reliable with a FC above 10.

And you definitely need some CYA in your pool, or you'll continue dropping to zero FC without constant attention. Don't overshoot, though. Bring the CYA up in steps.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...


Whats a good level CYA should be at (Eg 30?)? I picked up some clorox CYA, the kind that is basically white pellets (maybe i should have used liquid with intex?).. i think maybe i should have put in the intex wall skimmer? What do most people do? I spread it around evenly on the side of pool, but it just lays there mostly on bottom.. i did try the brush, but as of 12 hours ago after about 4 hours hadnt dissolved even with system on.

Back to FC, what should i target here.. FC of 6 on average?

As of yesterday, my FC was at 1, this with the salt system running 4-6 hours a day.. i did finally get the taylor test kit for salt, turns out it is exactly 3200 ppm too.. the intex salt system is showing bubbles when on.. maybe since before fully using this (chlorine dropped to zero) and only a few days ago shocking it to get chlorine back, its not quite stable yet and may need more shock or bleach for the salt system to stabilize?

I tried to view the ph in the TF100 kit.. hard to tell, but i think i'm at 7.2

Yeah my pool depth ranges from 45 to 46.5.. one spot i'm at maybe almost a full liner "block" visible, to another side where i have about 2.2 of them showing.. slightly not level on the one side but its fine.
 
Salt chlorine generating systems in general are very slow and gentle on the amount of free chlorine that they produce. You shouldn't rely on them to start-up the pool, they simply take too long. Hit the pool with a couple good doses of bleach to get the free chlorine level up to where you want it and let the SWG hold it at the right level. Even at 100%, the SWG just won't create it fast enough.
 
theskyisthelimit99 said:
Whats a good level CYA should be at (Eg 30?)? I picked up some clorox CYA, the kind that is basically white pellets (maybe i should have used liquid with intex?).. i think maybe i should have put in the intex wall skimmer? What do most people do? I spread it around evenly on the side of pool, but it just lays there mostly on bottom.. i did try the brush, but as of 12 hours ago after about 4 hours hadnt dissolved even with system on.

Back to FC, what should i target here.. FC of 6 on average?

As of yesterday, my FC was at 1, this with the salt system running 4-6 hours a day.. i did finally get the taylor test kit for salt, turns out it is exactly 3200 ppm too.. the intex salt system is showing bubbles when on.. maybe since before fully using this (chlorine dropped to zero) and only a few days ago shocking it to get chlorine back, its not quite stable yet and may need more shock or bleach for the salt system to stabilize?

I tried to view the ph in the TF100 kit.. hard to tell, but i think i'm at 7.2

Yeah my pool depth ranges from 45 to 46.5.. one spot i'm at maybe almost a full liner "block" visible, to another side where i have about 2.2 of them showing.. slightly not level on the one side but its fine.
Click to expand...
Generally speaking, CYA levels for SWG pools need to be higher. Mine's around 70.

CYA granules are fine, but they dissolve slowly and you don't want to just dump them in the pool because (as you have discovered), they just drop to the bottom and sit there. Most people pour them into a cotton sock or an old pair of nylons, and suspend that in front of a return to let the water flow speed dissolving. Even then, it can take a day. You'll need to brush those granules around and run your pump to dissolve them.

Check out pool school. There are detailed articles guiding you to the proper chemical levels, and the relationship between your CYA level and the necessary free chlorine level. There are even articles specific to SWGs, and how the chemical levels are different than when you're using bleach dosing to chlorinate your pool.
 
Re: Intex saltwater water system + ultra frame 18 by 52 bad for rust? Prevention?

Mickelin said:
Again, I ask where did you read that a SWG caused rust in an Intex pool? I have seen no evidence of that in this forum, only a lot of speculation and second hand rumors. The water in a SWG pool is not salty (i.e. not like seawater). You cant even taste it, the concentration is so low. It is the chlorine that causes rust, not the very limited amount of salt. The Intex pool will rust just as much without salt in the water.
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Our first Intex ultra frame rusted quickly while using the SWG that came with the pool. I looked outside one day about 2 years after we set up the pool and realized that it was leaning on one side. I walked around to that side and the pool leg had rusted right through and had slipped off the pad onto the cement. The ladder also rusted very badly. We decided to stick with straight bleach for our second pool and thus far haven't had any rust issues...
 
Re: Intex saltwater water system + ultra frame 18 by 52 bad for rust? Prevention?

liulady said:
Our first Intex ultra frame rusted quickly while using the SWG that came with the pool. I looked outside one day about 2 years after we set up the pool and realized that it was leaning on one side. I walked around to that side and the pool leg had rusted right through and had slipped off the pad onto the cement. The ladder also rusted very badly. We decided to stick with straight bleach for our second pool and thus far haven't had any rust issues...
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I wonder if that problem is worse in areas that don't get a lot of rain? The rain would wash, at least occasionally, the salt off. Just thinking out loud.
 
Just last night i noticed rust. This pool has been up maybe 4 weeks (brand new).. only 1.5 weeks or so has there been salt/swg going on.

I'm not 100% sure its really from the 3200 ppm of salt though.. bad paint on the joints maybe..? Not seeing it elsewhere.

So now wondering what the best action to counter it is? Shall i put some fluid spray on it and wrap the rescue (silicon) tape around it.. or do i need to sand the area then put some sort of paint over it.. or either

I also just put a deck on the one side.. i may need to crawl under there and at least spray some fluid spray on the support beam areas.
 

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