Newbie Questions--Seeking affirmation/guidance

[tessv]

10:00 update: estimated 4 hour loss of 13.5 (pool starts getting full sun at 7:45) FC=35.5; added 7 bottles, threw dolphin in, kicked up pump to max again.

*Running into town to see if I can find a Taylor FAS-DPD refill kit so that I can test levels after adding chlorine, too, just to be sure we are indeed climbing back to shock level. Worried I'm gonna run slightly below shock level inadvertently, but if I test this frequently, I'm gonna run out of test chems before this evening. My thought was that if the noon test replicates the 10:00 test where rate of loss is concerned (3.4/hour), I would try adding two bottles at 1 to see if that helps to sustain the shock level during the high UV hours. . . If that works at 2, then I'll stretch the evening a bit longer by doing hourly adds without testing. . .

*Will vacuum this afternoon per "the plan," and will backwash when filter reaches 15, since start was at 12?

(Do you guys think I should continue posting these updates? My thinking was that in doing so, it may be helpful to someone else down the road. . . but I'm not sure if it may be more beneficially concise to just update at the end of the day, unless I have a question??? I guess I'm also doing this in case any of you spot something that sounds wonky as we go. . . Let me know--I want to honor the culture & norms of the forum as much as I can.)

Thanks again for all of your help & support!!!

 

[poolneophyte]

I'm gonna run out of test chems before this evening.

That's the other drawback to SLAMMING at high CYA levels. You are going to blow through test reagents!

 

[YippeeSkippy]

Tessv, your posts are useful in the sense that we can follow along with you exactly how its going and you do a good job describing your situation. You're doing a great job.
I do feel it may be a useful record perhaps for others in the future who want to take on the challenge of a SLAM at such high levels of CYA. For example, the folks in California who are under major water restrictions might decide to try it? We certainly don't recommend it by any means, but... c'est la vie.

Get on it and go to TFTestkits.net and re-order whatever reagents you're going to need. They ship fast, and its very doubtful that you'll find it locally. I would also suggest that you use a 5mL pool water sample where each drop will equal 1ppm. It helps save reagents.

 

[aftrshok99]

Keep posting, posts are very useful!!!

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I would also suggest that you use a 5mL pool water sample where each drop will equal 1ppm. It helps save reagents.

Not trying to hijack your thread Tessv but YippeeSkippy would you recommend always using 5mL sample or just when doing a SLAM with high CYA?

 

[YippeeSkippy]

No, I wouldn't use the 5 mL sample routinely. I think its a skosh less accurate, but for someone running out of reagent during a SLAM it helps and they're in the ball park at least.

 

[tessv]

That's the other drawback to SLAMMING at high CYA levels. You are going to blow through test reagents!

Right???!!!


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[tessv]

Tessv, your posts are useful in the sense that we can follow along with you exactly how its going and you do a good job describing your situation. You're doing a great job.
I do feel it may be a useful record perhaps for others in the future who want to take on the challenge of a SLAM at such high levels of CYA. For example, the folks in California who are under major water restrictions might decide to try it? We certainly don't recommend it by any means, but... c'est la vie.

Get on it and go to TFTestkits.net and re-order whatever reagents you're going to need. They ship fast, and its very doubtful that you'll find it locally. I would also suggest that you use a 5mL pool water sample where each drop will equal 1ppm. It helps save reagents.

Thanks again, Yip! Found Taylor products!!! Picked up R-0879 & R-001... That's the same as R-0871, correct???


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[tessv]

Thanks again, Yip! Found Taylor products!!! Picked up R-0879 & R-001... That's the same as R-0871, correct???


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Oh--and my replacement stuff should get here tomorrow...


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[YippeeSkippy]

I'm sorry, I don't recognize those Taylor reagent numbers?

 

[tessv]

Thanks, Yippee--I'll do some research on that later--Will wait for my supply to run out. . . I'm hustling to get a bunch done this afternoon ahead of rain--like mow nearly 4 acres. . . Ha!

OKAY, WISE ONES. . . Something big to report here. . .
Just finished testing (was 1:00 instead of noon). . . I used my original test kit, initially completed the test at 5ml, per Yippee's suggestion. That test came out at 72!!!!! I questioned that, lol. . . retested at 10ml--got 50.5. . . SOOOOOOO. . . here's my thought--THIS IS GOOD, right? This represents a HUGE increase maintained from 10:00, when FC was at 35.5 (target is 47). . . If I stick with the 10ml measurement, since that's how I've been performing the test, it seems we had a 3 hour zero loss. . . which suggests to me we MIGHT be nearing the end??? COULD THIS BE TRUE????? HA!

My plan for now--I will not add any chlorine. I will keep the pump running at 3450. . . I'll go mow, and then when I'm done, test again and go from there. Am I thinking about this correctly??? Anything else you think I should do immediately?

OH--and I plan to leave the pool open during the rain to harvest some of that water for potential dilution support. . .

 

[tessv]

*ps. . . Went to TFkits and ordered the exact stuff to be overnighted--hopefully that gets here tomorrow, too. . . Think I just reordered Taylor stuff, but now I'm nervous I may not have ordered what I need. . . This will fix it!

 

[kcindc]

Not sure if it was mentioned yet, but you should have your pump on high the whole time you are SLAMing. Pump on 24/7, brush daily and backwash when your pressure is 25% above clean pressure, but not earlier... a dirty sand filter works better then a freshly clean filter. Best of luck!

 

[pooldv]

Yes, keep posting
Yes, it is great that FC is holding
Yes, use the 10ml yest
No, not necessary to test after adding if you have measured consistent increases and verified that Poolmath and your pool size are accurate.
Yes, that is a sign that the end is near!

How does your water look?

Overnight I would lower the pump speed to 2000 rpm or so.

Backwash your filter when the pressure rises 20-25% over clean pressure.

 

[tessv]

Alright folks! Good morning! I intended to post last night, but fell asleep on the sofa while writing!

Okay--let me catch you up. . .

To summarize how things have gone:

Date​	FC​	CC​	TC​	Ph​	TA​	TH​	CYA​	Salt​	CSI​	Notes​
6/30/16 8:00	15.0	2.0	17.0	7.2	250	375	100	3.8	0.31	Consulted with Forum re: results; advice to re-run CYA
6/30/16 12:35	10.0	0.5	10.5				120		0.28
6/30/16 18:45										Began SLAM—added 14 bottles of Chlorox 8.5%
6/30/16 9:45 PM	49.0
7/1/16 6:00	40.0									Added 4 bottles, brushed, kicked up pump to 3750 for 60 minutes, (filter pressure 12 when running at lower speed)
7/1/16 10:00	35.5									Added 7 bottles, added Dolphin, pressure still 12, kicked up pump to 3750, *pressure at this speed is 20
7/1/16 13:00	50.5									Added 0, kept Dolphin in the pool... checked pressure, still 20
7/1/16 17:45	42.0							3.9		Added 3. Vacuumed pool, pressure still 20--got in pool to do so, skin on feet somewhat itchy/burny, all skin felt this way after an hour.
7/1/2016 20:45:00	49.0							3.9		Added 0, pressure still 20, turned off salt cell for OCLT
7/2/16 6:00	49.0	0.0		7.5				3.9		Added 0, Pressure still 20 , began harvesting rain water (1-4 inches expected) PASSED OCLT!

Sooooooo. . . while we could get excited at the idea this appears to be done, I KNOW I MADE A ROOKIE MISTAKE!!!!!!! This just dawned on me. . . I should have had all the water features going the whole time, too, right? (Laminars, bubblers, sheers?) UGH. (I think the SLAM process instruction should add that in bold (MAKE SURE *ALL* PUMPS TO POOL ARE ON) for we inexperienced literal people who lack the "common sense" insight).

Here's my plan for today:
*TURN THE FEATURE PUMP ON!
*Continue harvesting water (we're expecting 1-4 inches between today and tomorrow) to help dilute CYA.
*Backwash filter with skimmers off to drain water from main drain as pool level rises.
*Test FC levels after filters have been on for an hour and note rate of FC loss. .
*Continue SLAM as necessary, Testing rate TBD by how much loss is noted after feature water is added to the mix
*Perform OCLT again tonight (best case scenario).

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QUESTIONS FOR THE COUNCIL:
PH--Can we talk pH for a second? I'm confused!!!
KNOWN VARIABLE: Okay, pH=7.2 when we began the slam--this was the case from both a strip and from the TF kit.
WHAT I THINK I'VE LEARNED FROM THE FORUM:
a. We expect pH to increase when SLAMing.
b. Water is "safe" to swim in with chlorine UP TO shock level.
c. pH is difficult to test accurately at high chlorine levels because it chemically changes the reagent, leading to falsely high readings--HOWEVER when CYA is also high, it can provide a time-buffer for that assessment and MAY yield fairly accurate readings.
QUESTION 1--when I tested pH this morning, it was 7.5--which should be ideal, right? Do you think that was accurate? If YES--what do you think caused the discomfort in the water while vacuuming? Was that the high level of chlorine, even though it should be "safe?" If NO, do you think the reading of 7.5 is actually falsely HIGH, and that really pH is much lower????
QUESTION 2--IF we don't think either of the pH tests are valid because of the very high FC/CYA, AND we know that the goal is a SWIMMABLE POOL BY MONDAY, is there another way to test it???
QUESTION 3--should I be doing anything with pH throughout the remainder of SLAM, given the ultimate goal of safe, comfortable water by Monday?

**I know this is another thing to add to the list of "WHY TO DRAIN SOME OF THE POOL NOW."

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The Filter:
QUESTION--I recognize that we caught this early, BUT, do you ALWAYS expect to see an increase in pressure throughout this process even if there were only a "little" gunk? (We are pretty religious about running the dolphin at least every other day and regularly run the pump 24/7 at around 2750. . . and vacuum weekly--so the pool isn't ever really "dirty." We don't get a lot of organic debris other than bugs & frogs.)

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The Toys & Stuff:
QUESTION--Should all the floaties/toys/balls/diving stuff be IN the pool during the SLAM? Will we re-introduce gunk into the pool when these are used again?

THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR HELP & SUPPORT!!!! And ANYONE is more than welcome to chime-in--I don't feel like it's a hi-jacking at all!!!! IT'S CLASS, and I love the "class-wide discussions!"

 

[tessv]

Update: after running the features for now 2 hours, I tested FC & CC... FC is 34.5, but CC is at 0.5... Are we done????
(Collected a little better than an inch of rain during that time)

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[YippeeSkippy]

LOL, you crack me up Tessv I love your posts.

I don't have a vs pump so have no clue about them. If it were me I'd crank it up just for fun, but that's not necessarily a logical answer, eh? And YES, definitely you want the high chlorinated water to run through all your water features!! Otherwise anything left off will harbor stagnant "cootie-filled" water. Blech.

As to pressure, a lot of teeny tiny algae can be caught in the filter and you didn't realize you had any... the filter is doing its job. Don't backwash unless the pressure rises 20-25%, not before. A slightly dirty sand filter actually works better than a scrupulously cleaned one. Towards the end of a SLAM is a great time to add a little DE to the sand filter because it really REALLY does wonders to catch the smallest of stuff fast. It "polishes" the water almost. Read this and consider giving it a try. Just make sure its pool DE and not the garden type. Pool School - Add DE to a Sand Filter

Good plan on the toys going in while chlorine is high- yup they can be loaded with schmutz. Look especially in those small button areas where some toys are inflated or manufactured- they can harbor a lot.

Just totally ignore the pH.. we tell folks to fix it at the onset of a SLAM because once you add all that FC it won't test right so its one less thing to deal with. Until you let the FC drop under 10 you won't get a good read. You should be fine. What exactly was the discomfort you experienced while vacuuming? I think I missed that mention....?

Now...HOW DOES YOUR WATER LOOK!?!?!

 

[tessv]

Thanks, Yippee!!!! You have a high tolerance for verbosity, lol! WATER LOOKS GREAT!!!!

It's still very cloudy and drizzly outside, second round of rain yet to come. . . Are you saying don't worry about that 6 hour FC loss of 13.5, and consider this done? (said with the anticipation of a 5 year old on Christmas) or should I bump chlorine back up to shock level one more time?

 

[YippeeSkippy]

If you passed the OCLT, your water is clear and your CCs are 0.5 or less... you're DONE!! Some folks like to do a second night OCLT but that's just for reassurance.

Chlorine at such high levels does tend to leave at a fast rate yet its probably the same proportion of loss if the FC were normal range. Let the FC drop to your desired level on its own, its safe to swim in. Of course draining and replacing a bit of water over the weekend is still a good idea. It will help lower the FC and the CYA in advance of your party. Every little bit helps.

Keep collecting rain water in hopes that your CYA will go down over time. I would still recommend a bit of a drain and refill, but if your pool is algae free now you can do it any time after the party.

 

[pooldv]

As filter pressure increases more slowly that is a good sign.
PH at 7.5 is fine. The PH test is accurate with FC up to 10 ppm. So, not accurate. There is no way to test PH with FC over 10ppm and no adjustments should be made until FC is 10 or less.
I wouldn't run all those water features too much, it will raise your PH.
Chlorine level at or below shock level for your CYA is comfortable to swim in. I've verified that quite a few times.

 

[tessv]

Yippee, I want to hug you! LOL. . . I have 7 bottles of chlorine staged around the pool to go in, if necessary. . . I didn't want to jump the gun on pouring them in if it isn't necessary and we can start letting that FC level come down. I knew I had passed the 3 criteria, but I was really uncertain about the impact turning on the features might have--can't believe I didn't consider that! I'm so glad I waited to hear your thoughts!

I just got my Taylor refills from Amazon (the ones coming from TFkits couldn't be overnighted by today due to the holiday weekend--they'll get here Tuesday. So, I will be in GREAT SHAPE if I have to do this again, lol. . . and that R0001 is NOT the same as R-0871, fyi. . .)

I also just thought about the fact that I haven't turned the Salt Cell back on yet. . .hmmmmm.

As we let the FC drift down to our target of 15, given our astronomical CYA--do you anticipate that we WILL be able to get accurate pH, or do you think it's gonna be impossible?

pooldv--are you in agreement with yippeskippy???

*See that badge next to my name now? That's because of YOU guys! THANK YOU!!!!

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Ah--pooldv, we must've cross posted. THANKS!!! I'll turn 'em off and call this DONE!!!! So--I'm hearing you say it wasn't the chlorine causing the discomfort, which means it must be pH, right??? FC of 9 is the bottom of our target range, so if/when we ever get there, I'll test it. . .

WOOO HOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! (early fireworks!)

You guys rock!