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Thread: To bond or not to bond... confused

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    Khreeo's Avatar
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    Smile To bond or not to bond... confused

    Hi there everyone, I am new to this but I've had this house with a pool for 2 years, so i am a pool novice. i just bought a Hayward Super Pump VS 1.5hp Variable Speed Pump. I am grounding it to the power supply as per standard practice. But I am not sure what to do with the bonding aspect of this pool equipment.
    I did notice the old Hayward pump; although grounded it was not bonded to anything and has been like this for many many years. My pool equipment is in a shed at least 14 feet away from the pool. The only metal part of my pool (which i have no access to) is the aluminum coping on top of which the stone coping is laid and glued, so completely covered.


    Do I still need to somehow bond the pump?

    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    borjis's Avatar
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Have you looked everywhere on the equipment pad for a bond wire (bare copper) sticking out of the ground / concrete?
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Quote Originally Posted by Khreeo View Post
    Hi there everyone, I am new to this but I've had this house with a pool for 2 years, so i am a pool novice. i just bought a Hayward Super Pump VS 1.5hp Variable Speed Pump. I am grounding it to the power supply as per standard practice. But I am not sure what to do with the bonding aspect of this pool equipment.
    I did notice the old Hayward pump; although grounded it was not bonded to anything and has been like this for many many years. My pool equipment is in a shed at least 14 feet away from the pool. The only metal part of my pool (which i have no access to) is the aluminum coping on top of which the stone coping is laid and glued, so completely covered.


    Do I still need to somehow bond the pump?

    I would bond it. It needs to be bonded to a ground rod driven into the ground or something conductive that goes into the ground.
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    Khreeo's Avatar
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    To bond or not to bond... confused

    Quote Originally Posted by borjis View Post
    Have you looked everywhere on the equipment pad for a bond wire (bare copper) sticking out of the ground / concrete?
    I'll look into that when I get home...thanks


    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    Khreeo's Avatar
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Quote Originally Posted by weird_tolkienish_f View Post
    I would bond it. It needs to be bonded to a ground rod driven into the ground or something conductive that goes into the ground.
    Without any bonding wires coming from the pool? Basically the pump will be the only equipment bonded, right?


    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    I'll be blunt. You do not bond anything to a ground rod. Ground Rods and Pools do not get along. Grounding and Bonding are not the same they should not be confused.

    The main object of bonding is to make it so the pool (the water) and the structural and mechanical elements around it have the same electrical potential. So if the deck or water is somehow energized then everything else is energized and current cannot flow. If current can't flow then us humans don't get shocked.

    There should be a thick copper wire coming from the pool. Dig around the edge of your deck, it will be coming out from there. If you can't find it post again or PM me with some pictures -- we will try to come up with some ideas.
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    borjis's Avatar
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    and to add that since it is not connected you might be looking for a green / brown ish wire (doubtful the wire itself will be clean copper, but slightly oxidized green or brown)

    when I found mine at the last house I owned it was dark brown / green looking
    16x32 IG Vinyl, 13,000 Gals. Hayward S-244T sand filter, SP2810X15 pump
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    Khreeo's Avatar
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Quote Originally Posted by gwegan View Post
    I'll be blunt. You do not bond anything to a ground rod. Ground Rods and Pools do not get along. Grounding and Bonding are not the same they should not be confused.

    The main object of bonding is to make it so the pool (the water) and the structural and mechanical elements around it have the same electrical potential. So if the deck or water is somehow energized then everything else is energized and current cannot flow. If current can't flow then us humans don't get shocked.

    There should be a thick copper wire coming from the pool. Dig around the edge of your deck, it will be coming out from there. If you can't find it post again or PM me with some pictures -- we will try to come up with some ideas.
    Image1466082228.008097.jpgImage1466082382.860249.jpg


    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    Khreeo's Avatar
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Thanks. I don't see any wires coming from my pool area. In fact I had the some stone work done last year and saw nothing similar to bonding wire. Attached is the pool today and what it
    looked like during the landscaping


    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    Khreeo's Avatar
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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Quote Originally Posted by gwegan View Post
    I'll be blunt. You do not bond anything to a ground rod. Ground Rods and Pools do not get along. Grounding and Bonding are not the same they should not be confused.

    The main object of bonding is to make it so the pool (the water) and the structural and mechanical elements around it have the same electrical potential. So if the deck or water is somehow energized then everything else is energized and current cannot flow. If current can't flow then us humans don't get shocked.

    There should be a thick copper wire coming from the pool. Dig around the edge of your deck, it will be coming out from there. If you can't find it post again or PM me with some pictures -- we will try to come up with some ideas.
    Thanks. I don't see any wires coming from my pool area. In fact I had the some stone work done last year and saw nothing similar to bonding wire. Attached is the pool today and what it
    looked like during the landscaping ....


    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Looks like there is nothing to bond to at this point. It is too bad that a bonding grid was not put under that nice stone work and tied into the pool structure.
    Unknown make 18' above ground (bought used in 1999) Sparco sand filter. Hayward 100,000 BTu heater. 2 speed pump

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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    Quote Originally Posted by danpik View Post
    Looks like there is nothing to bond to at this point. It is too bad that a bonding grid was not put under that nice stone work and tied into the pool structure.
    I know. I wish I had this discussion last year. I would have made sure that happened. My only recourse is to remove a line of stone work from the edge of the pool to the pool equipment and have it done right...Image1466087209.988159.jpg


    Khreeo
    Mississauga, Ontario, Canada
    16x32 Inground Chlorine Pool. Vinyl. Hayward Super Pump VS Variable Speed 1.5HP. Gas Heater

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    Re: To bond or not to bond... confused

    You are correct if there isn't a grid in place already then the only way to do it properly would be to tear up all that nice looking stone and install a wire mesh bonding grid. Its likely if there was concrete surround the pool before you did that stone work that the rebar in the concrete was used as the bonding grid around the pool. In Canada the bonding wire is required to be 6 gauge bare copper so it should be noticeable.
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