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Thread: Hello from Wisconsin

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    Unhappy Hello from Wisconsin

    Hi,
    I'm attempting to get my pool in shape after inadvertently turning it into a pond last year. We bought the house last year and I didn't get the cover on before the leaves fell. I filled it up and started trying to get it in shape w/ advice from a pool store. 4 cases of shock, 3 Quarts 50% algeacide. I was using 4 way test strips but I went to Walmart and grabbed a 6 way test kit to try and get clearer results. I started dumping in chems when I got home Friday night so 12:00 am or so. It was really foamy for awhile and alot of leaves surfaced whick I skimmed off and I used the rake to get as many off the floor as I could but I cant see the bottom so I don't know how much stuff I'm missing.


    Results as of 7:00am Sunday.
    CYA 95
    Cl see picture
    Br see picture
    pH 7.5
    Alkalinity 30 drops of titrant still yellow
    Hardness was blue from the start
    20160605_054739.jpg20160605_055318.jpg20160605_060200.jpg
    20160605_062129.jpg
    This is the result. I have no idea what the oily looking scum is or where it came from. It wasn't there until after it rained. I'd really appreciate some guidance in fixing this. Thanks in advance.
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    needsajet's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Welcome to TFP! and thanks for doing the signature

    You're going to need to SLAM Pool School - SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain

    It will be easier in the long run to exchange water to lower your CYA level, probably about 1/3 of your water.

    You'll be happiest with a TF100 test kit TFTestkits.net

    What you already have works for everything but chlorine. You need FAS_DPD, so the minimum you need to buy is the FAS-DPD kit TFTestkits.net

    Do you have a CYA test, or was that test result from the pool $tore?

    Until you decide how to proceed, brush the pool at least once a day and preferably 2 or 3 times a day. Run your filter 24/7 and backwash when dirty pressure is 25% above clean pressure.

    For the '4 cases of shock' could you give us weights with chemical name and % from the packaging. Same for the algaecide. Thanks.

    For your next tests, it's helpful if you post like this:
    FC well over 5
    CC not available
    pH 7.5
    TA 300
    CH 0
    CYA 95

    - - - Updated - - -

    Have you got any old tests showing copper and iron? If not, these are tests that might become helpful and recommendations can be based on pool $tore testing. For everything else, you're best off relying on your own testing.
    12k IG salt; glass beads in plaster; K-2006C, K-1766, CCL, and Aussie 4in1 (HTH); Pentair Eco800 1.2HP VS; Zodiac SWC 1.3 lb/day (25 g/hr); 25" filter recycled glass; OKU solar panels; 1/2 HP solar pump; Rebel (Warrior) pool cleaner; FlowViz; prior pool AG 10k | Read Before Posting to get the best possible advice | ... and this helped me a lot!: TFPC for Beginners

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    That test kit is okay for a small, clear pool. It at least gives you an idea of where your water is at.

    I have a couple of links for you. The first one is the most important as it is the corner stone of what TFP is all about. It is a lot of info. so take it a "bite" at a time. It will take some reading and rereading but it is SO worth it! The second link will give you the suggested levels for each pool. The third will tell you what to use to adjust each level.

    Pool School - ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

    Pool School - Recommended Levels

    Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals

    You are going to need more regents for you tests because you need to SLAM your pool. It is going to take some time and bleach to clear it up BUT we can help you do it. We need your help. You need to order a bigger test kit-TF-100XL. You can find the link to where to buy it in my siggy.

    Until you get your test kit you should drain your water like stated above. We have to get that CYA down so the FC can work better.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    CYA was one of the tests in the kit I bought.
    These are the chems I used.20160604_060107.jpg
    Shock: Sodium Hypochlorite 12.5%/ Inert 87.%%
    Algaecide:dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride 49.8% methyl benzyl ammonium chloride .2% other ingredients 50%

    I've had the pump running pretty much
    24 hrs a day since Wed when I added the first case of Shock. I did turn it off Friday before work because I had a dozen frogs in the basket when I got home Thursday night, that was a fun mess. I got way too many mosquitoes to be killing off my frogs.
    I've been reading as much as I can from the site, That's a lot of info you guys have put together. Thanks!

    I had a problem last year with it going green on me and I just added a bottle of algaecide that the previous owner left and the next day the water was clear and all the algae was on the bottom of the pool. I guess I was kind of expecting the same thing this time. Apparently a seasons worth of leaves over the winter is a bit more involved.

    Is it safe to be in the pool in the condition its in? It will be a lot easier to brush it down from inside than by leaning over the edge trying to push that flimsy aluminum pole.
    Last edited by Mad Roy; 06-05-2016 at 11:20 AM. Reason: realized that the text on the bottles wasn't really readable.
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Quick update: after reading some in Pool School I went out and redid the CYA test now that the sun is actually out. I got 60 and it repeated, do I need to still drain and top off the pool with fresh water?
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    That's great. You can work with CYA 60 without draining, and the chems you added will start you mostly down the track followed here, known as Trouble Free Pool Care or TFPC.

    Great news about the CYA, thanks. We don't know your chlorine level, so can't say if it's OK to go in the water, but there's a good chance. To measure above 5 PPM, you need the FAS-DPD chlorine test, which uses drops and can measure higher levels. The orange suggests you're well up and suppressing algae growth, but no way to know how high it actually is. At CYA 60 you can safely go into the water up to 24 PPM FC, which is also the shock level you'll use for your SLAM. You could find out by entering the quantity of chlorinating liquid you put in to PoolMath here and/or any other sources of sodium hypochlorite, such as bleach.

    If you want to get started while waiting for your kit, remove all organics that you can, brush and keep adding some bleach daily - a gallon of 8.25% bleach will add about 3.5 PPM FC and should replace whatever FC is lost to the sun, and some of what's working on the algae. We would need the FAS-DPD test numbers in order to recommend any stronger than that. FAS-DPD also measures combined chlorine (CC) which is one of the factors for knowing when the SLAM is done.
    12k IG salt; glass beads in plaster; K-2006C, K-1766, CCL, and Aussie 4in1 (HTH); Pentair Eco800 1.2HP VS; Zodiac SWC 1.3 lb/day (25 g/hr); 25" filter recycled glass; OKU solar panels; 1/2 HP solar pump; Rebel (Warrior) pool cleaner; FlowViz; prior pool AG 10k | Read Before Posting to get the best possible advice | ... and this helped me a lot!: TFPC for Beginners

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    It is a little high. I would drain about half of it to get it down to about 30. That way you will not need as much chlorine to get it clear.

    Let us know when it is done and what your levels are at that time.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Ordered the K-2006C 'cause I had to put it on my Amazon card. It should be here in a couple days. I'll update when I know more. Thanks.
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Yep 30 to 50 is the correct CYA range, and 30 is handier than 50 for the SLAM.

    I noticed that your fill water is from a well, and not sure of your limitations. The higher CYA option takes more bleach to get to the initial charge, and a bit more to maintain SLAM and for normal day-to-day chlorinating. You can decide which sounds best. Some people with wells have to be cautious about adding metals, which could be a consideration.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Roy View Post
    Ordered the K-2006C 'cause I had to put it on my Amazon card. It should be here in a couple days. I'll update when I know more. Thanks.
    That will work really well for you. Is the pool whitish cloudy? or greenish cloudy still?
    12k IG salt; glass beads in plaster; K-2006C, K-1766, CCL, and Aussie 4in1 (HTH); Pentair Eco800 1.2HP VS; Zodiac SWC 1.3 lb/day (25 g/hr); 25" filter recycled glass; OKU solar panels; 1/2 HP solar pump; Rebel (Warrior) pool cleaner; FlowViz; prior pool AG 10k | Read Before Posting to get the best possible advice | ... and this helped me a lot!: TFPC for Beginners

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Test kit arrived today as I was heading to work. I'll test the pool tomorrow when I get up and post numbers. Pool is cloudy green, although not as bad as it was. I can see the fourth step now vs barely making out the second earlier this week. Something I've noticed is that my pressure gauge is not going up very much. I'm running this thing 24 hrs a day in some pretty murky water and the water is slowly getting clearer but I'm not seeing a significant increase (less than 10 psi in 2 days) in the reading. Something to worry about or let it ride?
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    10 psi increase sounds significant. What is your clean pressure (after backwashing)? We recommend backwashing when the pressure is 20 to 25% above the clean pressure. Some people go a bit more than that, but it's a good rule of thumb.

    Glad you got the test kit. That pool is going to sparkle!
    12k IG salt; glass beads in plaster; K-2006C, K-1766, CCL, and Aussie 4in1 (HTH); Pentair Eco800 1.2HP VS; Zodiac SWC 1.3 lb/day (25 g/hr); 25" filter recycled glass; OKU solar panels; 1/2 HP solar pump; Rebel (Warrior) pool cleaner; FlowViz; prior pool AG 10k | Read Before Posting to get the best possible advice | ... and this helped me a lot!: TFPC for Beginners

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    If you're due for a decent rainfall, I'd hold off on draining any significant amount of water.
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

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    needsajet's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Excellent, now Casey on this thread and Kim. You're in very competent hands. It's getting late in Sydney so I'll miss your SLAM launch. All the best!
    12k IG salt; glass beads in plaster; K-2006C, K-1766, CCL, and Aussie 4in1 (HTH); Pentair Eco800 1.2HP VS; Zodiac SWC 1.3 lb/day (25 g/hr); 25" filter recycled glass; OKU solar panels; 1/2 HP solar pump; Rebel (Warrior) pool cleaner; FlowViz; prior pool AG 10k | Read Before Posting to get the best possible advice | ... and this helped me a lot!: TFPC for Beginners

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    6-9-16 @ 12:45 PM
    FC 16.5
    CC none detected (Followed directions, got no reaction. Normal?)
    pH 7.4
    TA 90
    CH 90
    CYA 60-70 (refilled tube a few times got varying results)

    Tank PSI is 14 after backwash and rinse. I've not seen it go over 20 even after running for 48 hrs straight. Just seems odd since the water is so murky. Not sure about the rain but looks like a drain is definitely in order.
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Here is a chart for you for the FC/CYA levels. Notice that the SLAM level for a CYA of 70 is a FC of 28. The most important part of the SLAM is M=maintain as in maintain the FC at or just a tiny bit over SLAM level for your CYA as seen in this chart:

    Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart

    It is up to you if you drain or not. How much will the water cost you? Do NOT drain all of the way. Leave about a foot or so in the bottom to hold the walls up and the liner in place.

    I DO know a SLAM will work to clear your pool. It will take chlorine, testing, brushing and time. You have to decide which way is best for YOU.

    Let us know what you want to do and we can help you along the way.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    I hope your SLAM is going well at 28 PPM FC. We'd love to see a clear sparkly pool in a few days!

    Filtering takes time for sure. My filter is a bit bigger than yours, and I have a smaller pump. Right after a backwash, mine is slow to filter until it gets a bit dirty. It works a little better for clearing the water right from the start if I run on slow speed and/or add a cup of pool DE to the filter via the skimmer. There's a procedure here for that, but heads-up that you would have to backwash more often and replace the DE if this method is used during a SLAM.
    Pool School - Add DE to a Sand Filter
    12k IG salt; glass beads in plaster; K-2006C, K-1766, CCL, and Aussie 4in1 (HTH); Pentair Eco800 1.2HP VS; Zodiac SWC 1.3 lb/day (25 g/hr); 25" filter recycled glass; OKU solar panels; 1/2 HP solar pump; Rebel (Warrior) pool cleaner; FlowViz; prior pool AG 10k | Read Before Posting to get the best possible advice | ... and this helped me a lot!: TFPC for Beginners

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    I drained some water (1/4-1/3) out of the pool and am refilling now. BTW I work 2nd shift so my schedule is a bit wacky plus we've been trying to get the house kid proofed somewhat for the arrival of the grand-kids for the summer. So when posting is sporadic that's why.
    questions...
    Is it safe to assume not to add chemicals until the water level is at full again so I can get accurate data for where the H2O chemistry is?
    Would putting the bubble cover on help protect the chlorine from the sun and if so will it be enough of a difference to be worth the hassle. I'm doing this solo since the wife flew out to fetch the G-kids this morning.
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    I don't think putting it on will really be worth the hassle but I tend to be a little lazy LOL

    I would not bother testing until you have the water where you want it AND the pump has been running about 30 mins. to mix it all up good. I would also do a good brushing to mix it up too.

    How old are the Grands? All summer?????? FUN TIMES!

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    Cool, thanks for the feedback. I wish it didn't fill so wretchedly slow.
    She's 7 and he's 3. The parents decided to move to Oregon so as a consolation we get them for 8 weeks over summer break. I almost feel bad for the rents 'cause these kids are gonna be spoiled rotten when they get them back. We've got 4 acres (mostly wooded) they can run around on. Plus enough projects to last till 2020. Oh yeah, and a soon to be sparkling pool.
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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    Re: Hello from Wisconsin

    UPDATE: POOL REFILLED AND CIRCULATED for 1/2 hour.
    FC 8
    CC .6
    pH 7.2
    TA 120
    CH 90
    CYA <30
    Temp 74 F

    Not sure about the exact CYA # since I filled the tube and could still see the dot although it wasn't perfectly clear.
    I entered the above #s into the pool math and got a shock value of 12. In order to get to that I need to add 220 oz/ 5.25% bleach and 42 oz. (volume) washing soda to bump up the pH.

    Should I pick up some stabilizer and add a slight amount to try to get a measurable quantity? If so how much to see a small increase?
    23000 gal AG (30' X 52" Round), Pentair Cristal-Flo II 22" Sand Filter, Pentair Dynamo 1.5HP pump (single speed). Taylor K-2006C test kit, filled from well.

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