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Thread: Want to go from green to blue

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    Want to go from green to blue

    Pulled a sample tonight, ran tests using my new Taylor K2006 kit and here are the numbers:
    pH: 7.4
    CYA: Unknown, definitely less than 30
    FC: 0.5
    CC: 0.5
    TA: 125
    CH: 200

    I shocked it with 8 gallons of 10% liquid chlorine and 2 gallons of 12.5% chlorine about 2 weeks ago. Unfortunately I was not able to stay on top of it. I also put about 4 of the 3" tricolor tabs in the skimmer at that time and have a floater with 4 tabs in it as well. It went slightly blue at the deep end but is going green again.

    The pool is in full sun most of the day.

    I have learned a lot in my lurking here but when this pool goes green, it gets really hard to get it back. It appears I have a stabilizer issue of some kind. I assume I need to add more? Anything else?

    Thanks in advance for the help.
    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    Yes, add 30 ppm of stabilizer in a sock or two as shown here, Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals. And then SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain your pool to kill the algae once and for all.
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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    Welcome to the forum. We'll get you fixed up with the SLAM process and you'll be good to go. Please read "ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry", too.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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  4. Back To Top    #4

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    I know that adding stabilizer reduces pH, which can also affect the chlorine effectiveness. Should I get the stabilizer level up first, then adjust the pH, then SLAM?


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    First pull those tabs out of the skimmer. That can really damage things.

    e: pH first, add enough CYA to shoot for 20 and SLAM away.
    32K gallon Plaster - 1hp Hayward 2 speed Super Pump - Hayward S200 Sand Filter - TF100XL
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  6. Back To Top    #6

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    Want to go from green to blue

    Ok...so after waiting close to a week to get my stabilizer levels up, I started slamming Friday night. I spent most of Saturday checking the chlorine, buying more, adding it, brushing and getting out the leaves and junk that continually rise to the top. I had set the FC level up to shock level for my stabilizer level, but by last evening wasn't seeing a whole lot of change. So I checked my stabilizer level and found it was much higher than I originally had measured (my initial reading was 50, and the reading last night was 80).

    What happened? Well, I need to take you back a few weeks. I added some stabilizer about 4 to 6 weeks ago. I just dumped it in the skimmer and called it a night. I didn't brush or anything. About a week before I began to slam, I checked the stabilizer level and found it was below 30, which surprised me. I knew from lurking in here that stabilizer sticks around, so I wondered where it had all gone. The pool gets full sun so I wondered if perhaps there was a loss due to evaporation. So I added more over the last week (put it in some pantyhose in front of a return, but again didn't brush) and I got the reading of 50 on Friday night and started slamming. As I was brushing the pool, I began to see bits of the stabilizer in the water. After looking at my readings, and remembering what I had seen, I realized that the brushing had probably distributed the stabilizer that had previously been added as well as the new stuff and it caused my levels to climb.

    I drained a little bit of water but mostly added some water to the pool (it was a little low anyway). My CYA level was at 60 this morning but I am thinking that if I don't see any improvement in the pool's appearance by midday today I might do a major drain and refill. This is where I need some help. Like I mentioned the pool sits in full sun the majority of the day so it appears a higher stabilizer level may be better. So I could just leave things as they and keep on slamming. Any suggestions?

    Regardless, I have learned that you must always brush WHENEVER you add chemicals to a pool. It makes a difference, and in my case a big one and perhaps a costly one in terms of time and money spent.


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    One of the reason we recommend putting the stabilizer in a sock and placing it in the skimmer is so the CYA will dissolve quickly. When CYA granules are poured directly into the skimmer they tend to get caught in the filter and will not dissolve completely for days, and if you wash cartridges or backwash your sand before it has dissolved you end up losing most of it. If you broadcast them directly into the pool they will just sit and dissolve more slowly if they are not well brushed into the pool. As you found out, CYA has to fully dissolve before it will register on the test and undissolved CYA will lead to false low results.

    Your slam will be less expensive in terms of bleach if you lower the CYA some, however you could keep it where it is and use the correct slam level for a CYA of 60. You need to look at cost of replacing water and time needed to complete it vs cost of bleach used to see which makes more sense for you.
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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    I decided to go ahead and do a partial drain and refill. Hopefully I can pick back up where I left off tomorrow.


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Want to go from green to blue

    After partial drain and refill, here's where I stand this morning
    CYA: 60
    pH: 7.2
    FC: 19
    CC: 1

    I added some soda ash to bring the pH up and added 84 oz of 10% chlorine to get the FC up to 21. (Used Pool Calc to get the number).

    The partial drain and refill got the pool from a darker green to a lighter green. My wife wasn't real happy about me draining and refilling and was also unhappy to hear that it was because I added too much stabilizer. I want to convince her that I am able to manage our pool but errors like that don't help


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    Just keep plugging away and soon she'll be amazed at how great the water is. Unfortunately, missteps and errors are sometimes life's best teachers.

    I would really focus on your CYA testing. It is a bit of a dance and takes some practice to get comfortable with it. Remember that you can pour the CYA mixture back in the mixing container and then back into the tube to retest as many times as you want. I usually do it a couple of times then store it and repeat the following day with similar sunlight. The tests can easily be off 10 ppm but it will give you an average you can work with.

    Your SLAM target is 24 not 21. The longer you consistently keep your FC at 24 the quicker all will go. Brushing will decrease the time as well. Hang in there and keep it up, it will be worth the effort and your wife will thank you, whether she mentions it or not
    16' x 32' (21100 gal), vinyl, 1.5 hp Hayward SuperPump,
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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    You didn't need to bring pH up, hopefully you didn't add too much soda ash. No matter now, pH test is not accurate with FC over 10, so just assume it's whatever you aimed for until after the SLAM.

    Another helpful hint, add 1/2 -2/3 as much as you think you need (based on Pool Math) on acid, soda ash or borax and CYA. Especially if it's large amounts. Then test again and add the rest. This has saved me from making a GIANT mistake several times.
    32K gallon Plaster - 1hp Hayward 2 speed Super Pump - Hayward S200 Sand Filter - TF100XL
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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    Quote Originally Posted by Pool Tool View Post
    Just keep plugging away and soon she'll be amazed at how great the water is. Unfortunately, missteps and errors are sometimes life's best teachers.

    I would really focus on your CYA testing. It is a bit of a dance and takes some practice to get comfortable with it. Remember that you can pour the CYA mixture back in the mixing container and then back into the tube to retest as many times as you want. I usually do it a couple of times then store it and repeat the following day with similar sunlight. The tests can easily be off 10 ppm but it will give you an average you can work with.

    Your SLAM target is 24 not 21. The longer you consistently keep your FC at 24 the quicker all will go. Brushing will decrease the time as well. Hang in there and keep it up, it will be worth the effort and your wife will thank you, whether she mentions it or not
    Thanks.

    I ran the CYA test twice, doing just what you recommended. I like the idea of storing the sample and doing another test later. Where do you store your sample? In the test kit? You are right, the CYA test is not that easy. It's hard for me to say exactly when that little black dot disappears. I'm thinking about having the pool store do a water test for me to confirm my observations. (Hope that's not considered sacrilege!)

    I see you used Pool Math to calculate the SLAM target. I guess I should just bookmark that rather than use the pool calculation app.


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bruce View Post
    You didn't need to bring pH up, hopefully you didn't add too much soda ash. No matter now, pH test is not accurate with FC over 10, so just assume it's whatever you aimed for until after the SLAM.

    Another helpful hint, add 1/2 -2/3 as much as you think you need (based on Pool Math) on acid, soda ash or borax and CYA. Especially if it's large amounts. Then test again and add the rest. This has saved me from making a GIANT mistake several times.
    I added about 2 lbs. Thanks for the reminder to go easy.


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    I think trying to have the pool store verify your CYA test is a bad plan. Their results may be close or more likely way off. You won't know then who's right and you don't want to skew your results to their's. Just continue trying it.

    Someone here devised a method to hold the cylinder up close to their head, fill to the 100 line then lower to their waist and just glance at the dot. If they could see it, they would raise it and add to the 90 line, then lower it to their waist and glance again. They repeated this until they ultimately couldn't see the dot at a quick glance. I have done similar, but instead of raising it I just fill the container a little without looking at the dot then look around for second and then look back to the dot. then repeat adding a little mixture at time. Ultimately, the intent is to try and not stare at the dot so your mind makes it reappear. Fortunately, the differences between 10-15 ppm is pretty negligible during normal maintenance. Even at SLAM is still not a huge difference, you just want to be in the right ball park.

    I store mine right in the case, I suspected the little red cap might leak but I did it accidentally one night without issue and have since repeated. That being said I could easily tuck in on a shelf in the cabinet with my test kit. You'll get confident soon enough and will laugh about having the pool store confirm you!
    16' x 32' (21100 gal), vinyl, 1.5 hp Hayward SuperPump,
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    Want to go from green to blue

    Looks like we've finally turned the corner. After sitting at light green for the last several days, I was getting impatient. I got some Yellow Gone on Wednesday night. However, I decided yesterday morning to try and stay the course and I upped the FC from the SLAM level of 22-24 for my CYA level to the mustard algae kill level of 32. Unfortunately that used up the last of my chlorine and I worked super late last night and didn't get out to check the pool when I got home and didn't buy more chlorine. This morning I looked at it and - victory! - i saw cloudy blue water. So we're getting somewhere.

    CYA: 55
    FC: 19
    CC: 0
    Is that CC level common when slamming? It's been that way for the last few days.

    The pool is definitely not clear but now I know what FC level works for my situation and I feel like I am on the home stretch. I will try and get to Walmart today for some more chlorine and try to keep my FC at that level. Hopefully I'll get to where we want to be.

    One other thing: in one of my other pool test kits, I found a vial that had a 5 mL mark. Because I was running low on the FAS/DPD reagent (I did order some more and got it), I decided to use that vial instead of the one in my Taylor kit. If I calculated correctly, this means each drop of reagent measures 1 ppm of FC. I imagine I lose a little bit of accuracy but not much.

    Thank you all for your help.

    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    CC at 0 during SLAM is not abnormal, especially if it's very sunny during the day.

    I suspect that level of FC isn't actually "helping" things move "faster", but it's your pool/money

    Are you testing and adding 2-3 times per day? Brushing once a day? How much are you losing overnight?
    32K gallon Plaster - 1hp Hayward 2 speed Super Pump - Hayward S200 Sand Filter - TF100XL
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  17. Back To Top    #17

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    Want to go from green to blue

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Bruce View Post
    CC at 0 during SLAM is not abnormal, especially if it's very sunny during the day.

    I suspect that level of FC isn't actually "helping" things move "faster", but it's your pool/money

    Are you testing and adding 2-3 times per day? Brushing once a day? How much are you losing overnight?
    I've been testing and adding twice a day - morning and evening (except for last night) and brushing every time. Before all this I didn't brush my pool that often and I've learned how critical that is. As for the OCLT figures, I've been losing about 5 to 6 ppm overnight. I didn't measure or add chlorine last night (because I didn't have any to add) so based on these numbers I lost about 13 ppm in 24 hours. I'm sure most of that loss occurred during the day since the pool sits in full sun. Thanks for the info on the CC level.

    As for your comment about my FC level: I know that it is low for my CYA level. I need to get it up and I intend to do that. What I was trying to say is that I had been trying to keep the level at about 22-24 and I wasn't seeing any significant change so I decided to bump it up to the FC level for mustard algae and that brought about some visible change. Now I just need to sustain it.
    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    a picture will help us
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  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Want to go from green to blue

    Been a while since I've checked in with you all. Let me tell you what I've been up to.

    Raising the FC to mustard algae kill level worked pretty well. I decided to go ahead and speed up the process by purchasing some Yellow Gone from Walmart. I put that in and following the instructions added 3 gallons of 10% chlorine at the time of application, then 12 hours and 24 hours afterward.

    After running the pump another 24 hours, I shut it off to give things time to settle. Prior to shutoff, I saw spots of brown dust which I assumed was dead algae. The pool was blue but very cloudy.

    After 3 days with no pump, I noticed slight clearing in the shallow area and some clearing in the deep end but not much. I have put the pump back on to run about 8 or 9 hours overnight, I am running my pool sweep, and have been adding chlorine to keep the FC level at about 9.

    This afternoon the kids and I got in the pool for the first time this season. I noticed the water was a slight green.

    My numbers tonight were as follows:
    CYA: 50 (down a little bit to some splash out from our swim today and from the dog getting in yesterday)
    FC: 6
    CC: 1
    pH: 7.2
    TA: 130
    CH: 200

    I added one gallon of 10% chlorine and 2/3 box of borax to get the chlorine and pH levels up. I also added about 8 ounces of clarifier to see if I can start to clear things up.

    I am pretty certain I have a ton of gunk at the deep end of the pool that contains some organics which are still eating up the chlorine. But the pool is so cloudy that I cannot see to vacuum and I would like to fix that.


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

  20. Back To Top    #20

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    Re: Want to go from green to blue

    Update: I passed the OCLT this morning with an FC level of 9. The pool is clear on the shallow end, not the deep end. My pH is up to 7.4.


    Joe
    33K gal, IG plaster,
    Permair 3/4 HP pump, 150 sqft cartridge filter
    Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend

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