Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: Starting with Fresh Water

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Starting with Fresh Water

    Time to get the pool going! We had a long winter, and then like 15" of rain in the last month... it has not been a good spring for pool owners here! We kept our 10,000 gal Intex type pool up over the winter... took the cover off today and it was a swamp. I debated trying to SLAM it, but a few factors led me to just drain it instead (it was already 25% drained, SLAM is more difficult with a sand filter from what I've read here, I won't be around to monitor it daily for the next week, etc...). So I am in the process of draining it now. Then I'll clean it out with bleach water and start filling probably tomorrow. I've read a TON of great information here in regards to maintaining the pool. I bought the Taylor K-2006c and a Speed Stir, so I'm ready to start testing the water. I have a SWG, so from what I've read here my numbers should look something like this:

    Salt- 200-400 ppm above manufacturer's recommendation (I have a test kit for the salt)
    CYA between 70 and 80
    FC between 4-6 ppm
    Alkalinity between 60-80 ppm
    pH around 7.5

    I'm starting with brand new city water. I plan to add my salt as soon as it is full and start filtering to get the salt dissolved. My real question is when to test to adjust the rest of the numbers. I know the SWG is more for maintaining... and I'll need to get the FC level up with bleach before then. Should I test my water straight out of the tap to see what the levels are first? And start making adjustments based on that while the salt is dissolving? I really just don't want to get any blooms before I even start swimming! If it makes sense to do so I'll test the tap water and post my numbers here for suggestions? Thanks!
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Your numbers and plan look good. Once it's full, get a sock(s) soaking right away with granule stabilizer for your CYA target for 70 ppm. At the same time, have some regular bleach on-hand for the first few days until your SWG is adjusted. On day 1 of new water, add bleach for a FC target of about 3 ppm. Once the stabilizer is dissolved, increase the FC to your ideal target area of 5. Then you can monitor the SWG for FC production.

    Then check pH and TA. Adjusting pH will be most important. CH should not apply. That's about it.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  3. Back To Top    #3

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Thanks for the info Texas Splash! I ran through the calculator, and it estimates my pool is around 9400 gallons. Should I anticipate my city water supply having any measurable amounts of FC or CYA? I guess I'm wondering if I need to test the tap water first, or just assume close to 0 for both of those and add the recommended amounts of bleach and stabilizer as soon as the pool is full. You recommended raising the FC to 3ppm initially. I show that'd be 59 oz of bleach (I have the 6%, not super concentrated). So just under 1/2 gallons. Should I just spread that evenly around the pool? For the CYA, I'm showing 88oz weight to get to 70ppm. The crazy thing is my SWG user manual suggests only 30ppm . I'm going to follow the recommendations on this site instead. Menards only had 3 1.75 lb tubs in stock, so I have 84oz of 100% cyanuric acid. Should I add it all at once, or should I add 2 of the 3 tubs and then test when it is dissolved? I guess I'm worried about getting the level too high and having to drain water. In the past I've just dumped that in and swept it around over the course of a few days. I see here it suggests putting it in a couple socks instead. Can I just float those in the pool? If I put that much in my skimmer basket I think it'd restrict the flow pretty good.

    If I understood correctly, I shouldn't worry about testing the pH or TA until I have my stabilizer and FC levels where they should be. Is that right? Thanks again for all the help!
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  4. Back To Top    #4
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Normally public water won't have any CYA. It may have some FC at low levels, but you'll want to check once full to make sure. Yes, the FC of 3 ppm on day one to give the CYA time to dissolve. You can slowly pour the bleach near a return jet while the pump is mixing the water. If you are concerned about circulation, you can also sweep or brush it around a bit. For CYA, it is not uncommon for many manufactures to list an antiquated CYA level (or other levels for that matter) based on old guidance. 70 will protect your FC much better. You can add the stabilizer all at one time using the sock method as follows:
    To increase CYA via granular stabilizer, place the required amount as calculated by the Poolmath calculator into a white sock and place in the poolside skimmer basket. For those concerned about suction flow to the pump, suspending the sock near a return jet or from a floating device will also suffice. Best never to allow undissolved granules to rest directly against the pool surface. Squeeze the sock periodically to help it dissipate. Once dissolved, consider your CYA adjusted to that programmed (target) level. CYA test readings should show a rise in 24-48 hours, however some pools may experience a longer delay to fully register. Best to confirm final CYA in about 5-7 days before adding any more stabilizer/conditioner.
    You can test pH and TA right away once the pool is filled and mixing a bit. Focus more on adjusting pH in the mid 7s first, then if TA looks really high/low, let us know and we can go from there.

    - - - Updated - - -

    For safety reasons, never add bleach and muriatic acid (for pH) at the same time. They don't play nice together. Separate by about 30 min or so to allow good mixing.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    The pool is up and the CYA is dissolving! I'll be turning on the SWG tonight (spent the last 24 hours filtering the new water and salt). I played with my Taylor test kit today and here is what I've come up with for FC, pH, and TA...

    FC- I THINK I'm at about 1.2. I was using the SpeedStir. The liquid would turn clear, and then turn pinkish again 5 or 10 seconds later. Is that common? Should I stop when the water first turns clear?

    pH- The test tube shows from 7.0 to 8.0, and it looks like I am slightly higher than the 8.0 reading.

    TA- I counted 120 on this one.

    CYA- Didn't test since it is still dissolving.

    So game plan? After measuring the depth around the pool, I now think it holds about 8,500 gallons. It is 20' round and 48", but the water depth is just over 3.5 feet. The SWG is just being turned on, so I'm planning on adding 4 cups of bleach to get back around the 3.0 range until the SWG is really going. The pH and TA are more confusing. I see that the best way to lower TA is to lower the pH to around 7.0. I'm guessing the pH is currently around 8.2, but that is a guess since the range only shows to 8.0. What are suggestions for lowering the pH slowly? How much muriatic acid should I add to be cautious? Thanks again! Messing with the test kit was fun this evening.
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  6. Back To Top    #6
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    We'll worry about TA later. FC is most critical at the moment to ensure you don't end-up back in the SLAM routine. Stabilizer is dissolving, so for today aim for an FC target of about 3-4 ppm. Tomorrow increase to 5 ppm and try to adjust to maintain that number (FC 5). To lower pH, use muriatic acid poured slowly near a return jet(s). Use the Poolmath calculator for dosage amount. Try to get that pH in the mid-7s. I would check CYA tomorrow evening or Thursday if the sun is out for accurate readings. Remember to always refer to the Chlorine/CYA Chart (link below) to ensure FC and CYA are matched properly.

    For FC testing, use the 10 ml sample size. Add one heaping scoop of powder and mix. Count drops from pink to clear and divide by 2. Example - 14 drops = FC of 7. As soon as you get that water clear, start the CC test. Don't wait too long or the water will begin to turn pink on you.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Think my post got deleted... I did the test again your way, and came up with 1.5 FC. I'll add around 5 cups of bleach to get the level up until the SWG is going. I did the CC test right after and came up with 3.0 (6 drops). I see that anything above .5 is bad. Is it normal to have a higher CC when first opening the pool with new water?
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  8. Back To Top    #8
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Not ideal, but then new water can be tricky depending upon the source. It would be a good idea to test FC frequently for the first day or so to ensure you keep the FC at the required level. Hopefully by tomorrow you see the CC go down with the sun's oxidation and FC will hold better. If that does not happen, let us know.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Thanks, Texas Splash. You've been very helpful.

    I added more bleach last night. I woke up today and did a test real quick, and didn't even get the water to turn pink with the scoops. My FC is disappearing fast. I was concerned that I'm doing the FC/CC tests wrong. I work a block away from a pool store, so I thought I'd take a sample in to them to see what their numbers show (I politely declined to buy any chemicals). Here is what they tell me I have:

    FC- .45 (The pool filled Monday. I added bleach then, and again last night. I'm thinking it just burned off until my CYA dissolved?)
    CC- .24 (This is way less than I tested. On the surface it makes more sense since I started with new water.)
    pH- 8.2 (This is what my test showed, too.)
    TA- 99 (I showed 120)
    CYA- 60 (This makes sense. My CYA was dissolved when I went home for lunch today. I put in a little less than recommended because I was worried about going too high.)

    The SWG is running today and is not throwing any error codes. It is a simple Intex one, so no fancy programming. I just run it 6 hrs/day. The plan when I get home is to add 80 oz of bleach to get my FC up to around 5, and add just over 2 cups of muriatic acid to drop my pH to around 7.5. Should I worry about getting the CYA up to 70? Or is 60 acceptable with the SWG?

    I did get some numbers on having an above ground installed. I'm 2 summers out from doing that I think. The place I went today only does Doughboy. The base package for a 21'/ 52" round installed with everything I need is $6,150. I'm just beginning to price these things! I'll post in the appropriate forum when I start getting really serious about it.
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  10. Back To Top    #10
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    A CYA of 70 would be best for your SWG. If I thought you might have an algae issue, I'd say wait and SLAM first, but I don't see that as an issue right now. You just have new water and are still trying to get everything in gear. Until the pool begins to balance, definitely keep bleach handy and add to keep the FC at about 5. That's going to be very important until the SWG gets dialed-in to support FC production. But also, just stick to your own testing. If you have any problems with a specific test, let us know and we'll walk you through it.

    FC test example: 10 ml sample of water plus one heaping scoop of powder. Stir & add drops until pink disappears. Take number of drops and divide by 2. (i.e. 14 drops = FC of 7).
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    I did the 10 ml the second time last night (the first time I did 25). For the CC test immediately after, the instructions say to add (4 or 5?) drops to turn the water pink/red again, and then add the other drops and count. Sorry, going from memory... I don't have the kit in front of me right now. When I added the drops to turn the water pink/red, it turned immediately after the first drop. Should I have continued to add the rest of the drops? Or stopped after the water changed color? I'm wondering why I got such a high reading for CC when I tested last night. I'm leaning towards thinking the pool store number was more accurate since it is new water, and that it was a user error on my end. I think I got the other results accurately.
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  12. Back To Top    #12
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    The directions do say to add 5 drops of R-0003, so I would do that. You know it may turn pink/red again, so continue with the R-0871 drops to make sit clear again and multiply by 0.5 to get your CC level. That is important for us to know. Even though your water was new, it doesn't mean it was perfect or that something isn't trying to grow while sitting, so we want to stay on it. So next time you get a chance, definitely run the FC and CC again to be sure. We'll go from there.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

  13. Back To Top    #13

    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Topeka, KS
    Posts
    10

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    I think my water was just going through crazy swings the first few days, and that made me think I was testing incorrectly. I tested last night (twice to make sure I was right) and it went well:

    FC- 7.5. I pushed it higher with bleach that morning because I wasn't sure how long to run my SWG. I'm going to let it drop down and try to keep it around 5-6.
    CC- ~0. The water barely turned pink, and then cleared up instantly with 1 drop.
    CYA- 70-75. That test is frustrating! I searched this site for tips on viewing that dot!
    pH- 7.6
    TA- 90

    I think the numbers look good. I won't be adding CYA since I do the SWG (and bleach as needed), so I shouldn't need to test that one too often, right? Hopefully my summer can consist of lowering pH with muriatic acid and bumping the FC with bleach when it needs it. I have 2 kids (6 and 10) so there is a lot of aerating going on! My daughter is having a swim party next weekend, and we have a family gathering the weekend after. I'll plan on raising my FC to 9 or 10 on each of those mornings since the pool will get heavy use. It seems like that is the common suggestion here... raising the FC 4 or 5 ppm before a big swim.

    Thanks for walking me through these first few days. I've read a lot of good advice on this site, but it is nice to have someone keep you calm when your own numbers are looking crazy! The family actually got in the pool last night. I was worried it'd be too cold since it just finished filling 3 days earlier, but it was manageable!
    8,400 gal above ground (Intex type) with Intex SWG and sand filter

  14. Back To Top    #14
    Texas Splash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    South-Central Texas, Marion/San Antonio
    Posts
    12,928

    Re: Starting with Fresh Water

    Those are good numbers so you are doing nicely. I would always check FC and pH daily just as a precaution for sanitary and acidic reasons, then the others maybe not as often unless you had some major water changes. Looks good. Have a great weekend.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •