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Thread: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

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    no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    I have a bit of weird situation going on and I "think" I have it figured out but just wanted to confirm with everyone here.

    I have a cartridge filter (in my sig), and with the OEM Hayward cartridge clean and pump on high, it runs right at 14 PSI. When it gets to 20 I clean it.

    I bought an aftermarket filter (Pleatco) and with it clean and my pump on low, the pressure does not even register (literally, zero). When I switch the pump to high, I get bubbles in the pump chamber and still not very much pressure (can't remember exact reading, but less than 2 if I recall right).

    I believe that the Pleatco filter is so non-restricting that on high the pump cavitates and introduces air into the system (bubble coming out of returns also). This DOES NOT happen with my OEM filter on low or high.

    Thoughts?
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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    duraleigh's Avatar
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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    I am not a cartridge guy but pump cavitation is not your problem.
    I believe that the Pleatco filter is so non-restricting that on high the pump cavitates and introduces water into the system (bubble coming out of returns also).
    do you mean "air" into the system or "water"
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Quote Originally Posted by duraleigh View Post
    I am not a cartridge guy but pump cavitation is not your problem.
    do you mean "air" into the system or "water"
    Yes, sorry, meant air and not water.

    And I also forgot to mention that it's not a suction side leak either because I just had a pressure side leak repaired and when they were done they pressure tested everything and it was good. Like I said, it only does this with the aftermarket filter and only with the pump on high
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    That is good, not bad. Mine also has 0 pressure when running my VS pump at 1100 rpm. Run it on high for a bit to clear the air and then it should be ok?
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    2012 build and pics, 20k gal gunite, black onyx pebblesheen, OK flagstone, IntellifoVS, cart filter w/Pleatco, IC40 SWG, Solartouch, 5 12'x4' solar panels, HP50HA heat pump, 8mil solar cover, borates, TF-100 test kit, SONOS, Doheny's Discovery Robot, hot tub on bleach

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Quote Originally Posted by pooldv View Post
    That is good, not bad. Mine also has 0 pressure when running my VS pump at 1100 rpm. Run it on high for a bit to clear the air and then it should be ok?
    I've tried that unfortunately. The air continues to form and come out of the returns. Any other ideas?
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    That means you have an air leak. The pressure on full speed should be at least 10 PSI or higher.

    Just because they pressure tested, doesn't mean you don't have an air leak it only means you don't have an air leak in your plumbing. The pump can still have an air leak because they can't pressure test that.

    Check the pump lid gasket and drain plugs for cracks. If they look ok, add a little pool lube to the gaskets and that should clear up your problem.

    Also, check to make sure the pool level is high enough and the skimmer weir is not stuck.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985 View Post
    That means you have an air leak. The pressure on full speed should be at least 10 PSI or higher.

    Just because they pressure tested, doesn't mean you don't have an air leak it only means you don't have an air leak in your plumbing. The pump can still have an air leak because they can't pressure test that.

    Check the pump lid gasket and drain plugs for cracks. If they look ok, add a little pool lube to the gaskets and that should clear up your problem.

    Also, check to make sure the pool level is high enough and the skimmer weir is not stuck.
    check, check, and check. I've already done all of that. Maybe it is the pump itself. It's only a year old
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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    mas985's Avatar
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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    You might have a crack in the housing somewhere. If you look in the pump basket, does the air look like it is coming from the pump inlet?

    Did you also check the pump unions, if you have them, to make sure they are sealed well.

    The air is coming from somewhere, it doesn't magically appear.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985 View Post
    You might have a crack in the housing somewhere. If you look in the pump basket, does the air look like it is coming from the pump inlet?

    Did you also check the pump unions, if you have them, to make sure they are sealed well.

    The air is coming from somewhere, it doesn't magically appear.
    I can't tell where the air is coming from when it's on high like that. What you're saying makes sense. I need to check the housing and unions, haven't done that yet. If there is a leak, it is super tiny.

    No chance it could be the pump cavitating? I've only read about that while searching

    Maybe I'll try taking a video, see if you guys can see where the air is coming in
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Cavitation doesn't create air in the pump basket. Cavitation is caused by very low pressure and creates vapor bubbles (water boils) inside the impeller and as the water flow pushes these bubbles toward the outer portion of the impeller where the pressure is higher, the bubbles implode. This is what causes damage to the impeller and why no cavitation vapor bubbles can exist outside of the impeller. With a pool pump, you can only hear cavitation but never see it.
    Mark
    Hydraulics 101; Pump Ed 101; Pump/Pool Spreadsheets; Pump Run Time Study; DIY Acid Dosing; DIY Cover Roller
    18'x36' 20k plaster, MaxFlo SP2303VSP, Aqualogic PS8 SWCG, 420 sq-ft Cartridge, Solar, 6 jet spa, 1 HP jet pump, 400k BTU NG Heater

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Quote Originally Posted by mas985 View Post
    Cavitation doesn't create air in the pump basket. Cavitation is caused by very low pressure and creates vapor bubbles (water boils) inside the impeller and as the water flow pushes these bubbles toward the outer portion of the impeller where the pressure is higher, the bubbles implode. This is what causes damage to the impeller and why no cavitation vapor bubbles can exist outside of the impeller. With a pool pump, you can only hear cavitation but never see it.

    This is excellent information, thank you. Will keep looking.
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Here is an article from Pool School about suction leaks that might help, Pool School - Suction Side Air Leaks
    TFP Moderator
    If TFP helped you or saved you money - Become a TFP Supporter! <--Click here
    2012 build and pics, 20k gal gunite, black onyx pebblesheen, OK flagstone, IntellifoVS, cart filter w/Pleatco, IC40 SWG, Solartouch, 5 12'x4' solar panels, HP50HA heat pump, 8mil solar cover, borates, TF-100 test kit, SONOS, Doheny's Discovery Robot, hot tub on bleach

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    Re: no pressure with aftermarket cartridge

    Quote Originally Posted by pooldv View Post
    Here is an article from Pool School about suction leaks that might help, Pool School - Suction Side Air Leaks
    thanks PoolDV
    15,000 gallon free form Viking fiberglass pool. Hayward Star-Clear Plus C12002 cartridge filter. Hayward Swim Pure Plus T-15 SWG. Testing with TF-100 Kit. 2 speed 1.5HP Supreme pump. Dolphin Nautilus robotic cleaner

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