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Thread: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

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    Question Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Hey Guys,

    I'm having issues with my PH again, as well as CYA of 0 and slightly raised TA. I understand lowering PH will lower TA however do I fix the PH or CYA first as I understand increase CYA has an affect on PH.

    FC: 3.5
    CC: 0.5
    TA: 140
    CH: 340
    CYA: 0

    Thanks
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Fix the CYA first,
    CYA is acid and acid of any sort will lower the pH.

    TA is the very last thing you need to do. All others come before it.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    OK just put a sock full of CYA - now wait a few days....

    Is it still safe to swim while doing this?
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Yes, safe to swim with the CYA dissolving. If you are swimming, I might prefer it be in the skimmer so the cloudiness is not in the pool.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    How high is your pH? Your TA is pretty high, so your pH will naturally rise pretty fast and may cancel the pH drop the CYA causes.

    You can swim safely if the pH is between 7.2 and 7.8. Higher or lower may lead to dry itchy skin and burning eyes. So you may wish to adjust pH to at least 7.5 if you're at the top end of the scale. Or off the scale without knowing it.

    TA is the last parameter you worry about.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard320 View Post
    How high is your pH? Your TA is pretty high, so your pH will naturally rise pretty fast and may cancel the pH drop the CYA causes.

    You can swim safely if the pH is between 7.2 and 7.8. Higher or lower may lead to dry itchy skin and burning eyes. So you may wish to adjust pH to at least 7.5 if you're at the top end of the scale. Or off the scale without knowing it.

    TA is the last parameter you worry about.
    No real idea what PH is as my test kit only test to 8, I believe it is a lot high. Do you just putting in some M Acid in addition to the stabilizer (which has dissolved from the sock).
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Quote Originally Posted by onedah View Post
    No real idea what PH is as my test kit only test to 8, I believe it is a lot high. Do you just putting in some M Acid in addition to the stabilizer (which has dissolved from the sock).
    If you're at the top of the scale, enter that number for the pH along with the TA reading and add the dose of acid poolmath figures for you. Let it mix well and test again. Just keep doing that until the color moves. You might hit it or you might be high still, but you'll be on the scale and the last application should do it.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard320 View Post
    If you're at the top of the scale, enter that number for the pH along with the TA reading and add the dose of acid poolmath figures for you. Let it mix well and test again. Just keep doing that until the color moves. You might hit it or you might be high still, but you'll be on the scale and the last application should do it.
    I did as poolmath suggest - levels of what I have tested are:

    FC: 8
    CC: 0.5
    PH: 7.2
    TA: 100
    CH: Not Tested
    CYA: Not Tested

    I will test CYA in a few days and keep an eye on the PH - I am supprised that I managed to get PH to 7.2 already and TA dropped so quick.
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    I tested again this morning and no FC loss so good on that front however PH started to rise again - its at 7.5 since last night.

    We did have rain most of the night but would that effort the reading? Should I look at adding some more MA?
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    7.5 is fine. Just don't let it go above 7.8.

    It's possible the aeration of the rain raised it, or 7.5 is its happy zone.
    32K gallon Plaster - 1hp Hayward 2 speed Super Pump - Hayward S200 Sand Filter - TF100XL
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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    PH hit 7.8 today - I'm gonna add some MA and see how it goes.

    My FC level is consistent so no worries that end. need to re test CYA.
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    My PH is on the rise again - hit top of my kit 8.0 - I have added more MA per poolmath, we had rain again in Dallas yesterday but could it be messing with my PH that much?

    Also tested my CYA and got a reading of ~70, I had a CYA of 0 6 days back and added stabilizer, actually less then poolmath however CYA has over shot.

    I'm going to wait and test CYA again tomorrow before I empty some of the water.

    Any suggestions in the meanwhile?
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    Rain can seriously aerate the pool and drive pH up. Sounds normal.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    My PH seems to still be rising but a lot slower than before - as suggested the rain hasn't help.

    I did measure my CYA again and this time I got a reading of 50, so it appears to have gone down from 70, understand this test can be very subjective, however can rain also play a big part in CYA i.e. the amount of rain we have had in the past week could help reduce CYA just like replacing % of the water with new water?
    17500 Gallons, IG, Plaster, DE Filter, Built 1997, No Spa, Polaris 280

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    Re: Do I fix CYA or PH and TA first?

    One day I will have a neon electric flashing sign on the forum....."Rainwater has very little effect on your pool water" It is one of the hardest to shake "pool myths" I think perpetuated by pool stores so they can sell you some anti-rain gizmo's.

    That said, if you have a gullywasher that flows into the pool from the surroundings, well, there is almost no bigger mess!!
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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