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Thread: Elks Pool

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    Elks Pool

    I am a member of the Benevolent and Protective Order of Elks, Brunswick Lodge 691. We have A 50' x 25' old plaster pool (from 4 to 8.5 feet deep, I figure it's about 55,000 gallons) that is currently being serviced by a local pool company. It has a large tablet chlorinator (about 4' tall and 5 or 6" diameter), a really big but old sand filter, and a relatively new Hayward pump on a mechanical timer. Just yesterday, we invested $1,100 in new chairs and lounges with metal frames. We spend upwards of $1,600 per season on the pool service which includes chemicals. I just got put in charge of it, so I am going to need to "pick some brains" around here. My experience is only with my little above ground Intex per my signature.

    Let's talk potential conversion to SWG system and maintenance.

    POTENTIAL CONVERSION:
    1. To convert this system, I understand that all I would really have to do is to replace the tablet chlorinator with an SWG unit. What SWG unit would be appropriate and what would be a realistic cost?

    2. We have metals ladders, a stone/brick edging around the pool and a painted concrete-type deck (not sure what material is under the paint) and, as stated, really old equipment. Will the salt corrode this over time and if so, how much time?

    MAINTENANCE:
    3. The pool service is going to come once per week and spend no more than 45 minutes. What should I expect him to do for his $30/week fee?

    4. What do I need to be doing on top of what he does? I figure, I'll have to vacuum the bottom of the pool, clear leaves out of skimmers, etc., but what else?
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    cowboycasey's Avatar
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    Re: Elks Pool

    Is this considered a public pool or private?
    How many people use it a day?

    Salt water at 3500ppm may take some life away from equipment, how much is the unknown but I figure a year, so if your pump is suppose to last 10 years make it 9... that is the funny part though, water only touches the plastic part of everything, so unless you're spraying pool water on the outside of the equipment it should be no different.. you're already running a salt water pool, I would guess at about 1500ppm or so using pucks..

    You really need to buy a TF100 and XL option as you are going to go through it testing unless they already have the Taylor K-2006C

    On to SWG my favorite part..

    Hayward makes a big huge unit called the Saline C 6.0 that will do 6 pounds of chlorine a day and is used in commercial pools up to 60k gallons, it makes 3 to 4 times the chlorine than a 60k for residential use. it would go in the same spot your puck system is now.
    Hayward Saline C 6.0 Salt Chlorine Generator | Sanitizers | Commercial - Hayward Pool Products
    Hayward Saline C 6.0 Commercial Salt Chlorine Generator HCSC60

    Full Market Comparison of Salt Water Chlorine Generators for Swimming Pools

    it would take 2 of the RJ60 or the RJ60 plus to get to 6 lbs a day and it would be about 1000 dollars less
    CircuPool® RJ-60 Salt Pool System
    CircuPool® RJ-60 Salt Pool System


    It would take 4 normal hayward or 3 pentair systems to get to 6 lbs a day
    Hayward® Aqua Rite Chlorine Generator (with T-CELL-15 Turbo Cell) Salt Pool System
    Pentair® IntelliChlor IC60 Chlorine Generator Salt Pool System

    Good luck, I hope this helps
    Pool: Intex 16x32 15000 gal, 2 speed 340042, Pentair CC320 Filter, CircuPool SJ45 Salt System, Intermatic PE653RC; Hot Tub: 650 Gal SWG Megachlor
    links: pool school * Recommended-Levels * SLAM * CYA chart * Test kits * How To Post Pictures * Poolmath * OCLT ** Support your website if we helped you :) **

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    Re: Elks Pool

    Welcome to the forum.

    That's a big pool and will require some attention to detail.
    1. To convert this system, I understand that all I would really have to do is to replace the tablet chlorinator with an SWG unit. What SWG unit would be appropriate and what would be a realistic cost?
    Patrick at INYO pools has dealt with me on a couple of oversized pools and he has some good SWG guys. They have some discounts available for TFP sponsors.....check him out. Swimming Pool Supplies, Pool Safety Cover, Swimming Pool Covers, Swimming Pool Pumps, Pool Pump Parts - INYOPools.com
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Mod Squad YippeeSkippy's Avatar
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    Re: Elks Pool

    Being that you're on St.Simons Island, your pool deck and equipment are already somewhat exposed to salt from the ocean waters. And long term use of *any* chlorine leaves a residual of some salt, so you may very well have more salt than you realize.

    I vote for the TF-100 XL, Speed Stir device to make testing faster, and some reading in our Pool School links up at the top of this site.

    As to the Pool Maintenance contract- I'd want to know what chemicals they would (and would NOT) use to care for the pool? I'd expect a good weekly brushing of the pool, emptying skimmers and checking all the equipment. Also leaving you confirmation of what they found, did or noted. I'd suggest your own testing during the week to confirm what they're doing...or not doing. Be cautious of random algaecide and stabilizer additions if you aren't sure they're actually useful to you. Some times stabilizer levels get too high from pool companies use in pucks and then it requires emptying and refilling. This is avoided by close monitoring of the levels.

    Holler back with further questions
    My Amazon Smile for November12K Fiberglass IG, Infinity 4000 automatic cover, SWCG, Hayward Sand Filter, Hayward 1.5 Pump, Doheny Discovery Robot, Savi Melody LED pool lights, outdoor speakers and other assorted doo-dads. Sundance Altamar Hot Tub.
    Our pool build--> Our Pool Solved Our Sloping Yard Skippy's Cheap Pool Cooler -->Skippy's New Fountain

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    Re: Elks Pool

    I strongly suspect this is a public pool. I would call the local health department first and ask for a copy of the rules that apply to public pools in your county and state. Read it , twice.

    At $30 per week that is probably a commercial rate. In addition to balancing the chemicals brushing etc, the maintenance guy should be compiling with the local rules. He should be certified in public pool care and he should be maintaining a logbook of test results and chemical additions on the site. ALL PUBIC POOLS SHOULD HAVE A LOGBOOK.

    I would take Dave's suggestion above and contact Partick at Inyo about a salt system. Pentair's IC 60 comes in a commercial model that can be hooked together for your large pool. But you need someone who understands how that all works to help you.
    22k gallon IG pebblefina, Jandy 1.5 HP VS, Jandy CV Cartridge filter, Fafco solar panels, Polaris 360 supply side cleaner, waterfall

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    Re: Elks Pool

    Also, I'd like to watch him work to see what he does.

    I got Group On gift of a month's free pool service. He was dropping the test drops directly into the water.

    He did a quick brush and skim, dropped a handful of something in the skimmer, dropped the drops in the pool and left. I was totally steamed and asked him not to come back.

    You just never know what going on in people's minds when they do "service".
    SWG: CircuPool (May 2014) SI30+Plus; 3000ppm seems ideal;
    My Ideal Specs:
    FC 5; PH 7.4-7.6; TA 90; CH 350; CYA 75; = SI ~ 0.19
    14,000 gal, in ground, plaster, Cartridge filter, Borates
    TAYLOR K - 2006

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    Re: Elks Pool

    The comments made me look up the law and this pool qualifies as a "semi-public" pool as we are a private fraternal organization and do not charge a daily fee. I read the Board of Health regulations and we comply in all respects. It's recommended levels are the same as here. The Lodge is actually on the continental side of the salt marshes, so there's not a lot of salt air. The testing kit on site is a Taylor k-2005. I tested this Saturday and forget to bring results home. By memory, they are pH 7.4, FC 1, CH 80, TA 180. Didn't measure CYA. There was dirt on bottom and auto vacuum was at work. This morning, it was a bit low on water level, but more importantly, it wasn't sparkling. Not cloudy, but dull. I'll have to meet up with the pool service guy to see what all he's doing.

    The Hayward Saline C 6.0 is a $4,000 unit and the Intellichlor IC 60 is a $1,000 unit. They are both for "up to 60k" gallon pools. What's the real difference?
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    The Hayward can produce 6 pounds of chlorine gas a day while the IC 60 can only produce 2 pounds of chlorine a day.

    I have a feeling they are both rated for 60,000 gallons due to the market they are intended for. A typical residential pool will lose most of its chlorine to the sunlight, while a commercial pool will lose a lot of the chlorine killing off waste from swimmers and sunlight.
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
    Hayward Aqua Rite T-15 SWCG, Jandy LXi 400k BTU NG heater, 350 sq.ft. of Sun Star solar panels, TF-100 Test Kit, Dolphin s300i Cleaner
    Test Kits . Pool Math . Chlorine/CYA Chart . The SLAM Process

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    Re: Elks Pool

    Ping, we have maybe 12 swimmers total during the week and 12-18 swimmers total on Saturdays and Sundays, the point being that it doesn't get that much use on a regular basis, not like a real commercial pool does. So I suppose the issue is to figure out how many pounds of chlorine we need to generate. We are currently using 3" tri-chlor pucks. Is there a way to figure out how many pounds per day chlorine we use we consume?
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    You can use PoolMath to help calculate any additions and what the effects will be on the water. Enter 55,000 for the gallons and at the bottom of the page there is a section, Effects of adding chemicals. Each puck usually weighs 8 ounces so enter 8 ounces of trichlor and it will calculate out the results for you.

    If you are running the pool pump 24/7, then the IC60 should be able to handle the load, but it will not last nearly as long as the Hayward Saline C 6.0. If I was in charge I would chose the Hayward over the IC60. Did you give Inyo a call to see what they recommend?
    16k gal plaster with raised spa, Jandy DEV60 filter, 2 HP 2-speed SHPF Jandy Stealth pump
    Hayward Aqua Rite T-15 SWCG, Jandy LXi 400k BTU NG heater, 350 sq.ft. of Sun Star solar panels, TF-100 Test Kit, Dolphin s300i Cleaner
    Test Kits . Pool Math . Chlorine/CYA Chart . The SLAM Process

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    Re: Elks Pool

    Since Friday afternoon, water level dropped 3", all 5 trichlor pucks were consumed, water clarity stinks. Today FC 1.5, CC 0, pH 7.4, TA 90, CH 300. Our trichlor puck are standard 3" and label says it's 99% trichlor, comes in 50 lb bucket and recommends 1 to 2 pucks per 6,500 gallons per week. At 55k gallons, I calculate that to be about 10 pucks per week. Label does not say how much each puck weighs or how many pucks per bucket. Standard sizes seem to be 6, 7 or 8 oz. (I failed to notice the brand name on the bucket.) A hose was out of place so someone might have added water over the weekend. Don't know how much use it got or how much of the 3" loss is due to splash out.
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    I would go with the Hayward. It gives you extra capacity and you don't have to run the pump as much. It will allow you to keep the chlorine at just above the middle of the range all the time and have the ability to punch it up if you need to.

    A full set of test results would be great.
    22k gallon IG pebblefina, Jandy 1.5 HP VS, Jandy CV Cartridge filter, Fafco solar panels, Polaris 360 supply side cleaner, waterfall

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    Re: Elks Pool

    Test results in last post (excluding CYA). Set up bucket test yesterday about 6:45 PM. I doubt the pool will get used today, but I put a sign on it anyway, so hopefully it won't get disturbed. ATM, my two issues are water clarity and water loss, but I'm working on it.
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    Noticed pump was set to run 24/7. I scaled it back today to 12 hours. Consumed 12 pucks over the weekend (set at 2.0). Water clarity is better. Bucket test got disturbed and failed (again). Lost 3" of water. Only 10 people used it Saturday, 3 on Sunday. Today it was raining, so I didn't test. Thinking about scaling pump run time back to 8 hours/day.
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    We may have bad reagents! Yesterday morning pH tested off the chart high. By afternoon the test said 7.2. Today initial result said 7.0, but I put it down without emptying it. Five minutes later is was almost 8. In that same time period a color of 1.0 FC changed to 0 (clear) (We are using the K-2005 kit...grr, not titration.) The reagents are stored in the dark, but it can get mighty hot and mighty cold in that room during summer and winter. I have no idea how old they are. What are symptoms of bad reagents?
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    I can't get the water to clear up in this 55,000 gallon concrete pool (using tri-chlor and cal-hypo). Sand in filter was 6 years old. Replaced it. Got FC above shock level at 13. CC is zero. pH is 7.5. I don't recall the exact numbers, but TA and CH are within limits. Didn't test CYA, but would anticipate it to come in on the low side since we're always having to add water. Water appears somewhat green-ish (not really, but kinda) and just generally is yuckity-yuck-cloudy. Got pump running 24/7 on a 12 hour turnover.


    What gives?


    P.S. - ignore my signature line. That's the home pool. This is a semi-public pool that averaged 11 bathers per day in June.
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Re: Elks Pool

    you need to test your CYA, they always use tri-chlor?
    15,000 gallon inground fiberglass pool with spa. 350lb Sand filter, 1.5 hp pump, and heater

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    Mod Squad YippeeSkippy's Avatar
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    Re: Elks Pool

    Stop using anything except liquid chlorine for the sanitizing. Calhypo may be making it cloudy and trichlor is just making the CYA higher and higher, which is not a good thing.
    My Amazon Smile for November12K Fiberglass IG, Infinity 4000 automatic cover, SWCG, Hayward Sand Filter, Hayward 1.5 Pump, Doheny Discovery Robot, Savi Melody LED pool lights, outdoor speakers and other assorted doo-dads. Sundance Altamar Hot Tub.
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    Re: Elks Pool

    Yes, but pool was recently (2 months ago) filled with new water. Plus I tested CYA a month ago and it was very low....something around 20 or less.

    Cal-Hypo makes it cloudier?
    Home pool: Intex 11,400 gallon AG vinyl pool with sand filter & SWG. Taylor K-2006 test kit - coastal Georgia. I'm also in charge of the Elk's Lodge Pool, which is 55,000 gallons in-ground concrete with sand filter, 2 HP Hayward pump, currently using tri-chlor pucks and cal-hypo system.

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    Mod Squad YippeeSkippy's Avatar
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    Re: Elks Pool

    Calcium can, just as a warning so you don't get a surprise. I hadn't realized you'd drained and refilled? Can you provide us with the most current test results?
    FC
    CC
    pH
    TA
    CH
    CYA

    Thanks
    My Amazon Smile for November12K Fiberglass IG, Infinity 4000 automatic cover, SWCG, Hayward Sand Filter, Hayward 1.5 Pump, Doheny Discovery Robot, Savi Melody LED pool lights, outdoor speakers and other assorted doo-dads. Sundance Altamar Hot Tub.
    Our pool build--> Our Pool Solved Our Sloping Yard Skippy's Cheap Pool Cooler -->Skippy's New Fountain

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