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Thread: Stabilizing PH

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    Stabilizing PH

    I have recently switched to the TFP method and I am having a little trouble getting the PH to stabilize. My readings yesterday were as follows:
    FC-2
    CC-0
    PH-7.5
    TA-110
    CH-265
    CYA-40

    Added 65 OZ of 10% Liquid chlorine

    Today readings
    FC-5.5
    CC-0
    PH-7.0
    TA-110
    CH-265
    CYA-40

    Action:
    Aerating for 30 min using sheer descent waterfall

    FC-5.5
    CC-0
    PH-7.8
    TA-110
    CH-265
    CYA-40

    This has been going on for a week. With the only chemical addition to the pool is 10% chlorine. Pool is crystal clear with no other problems. PH goes down to 7.0 or lower then comes back up to 7.8-8.0 with aeration. Cycle then repeats. I am hesitant to add additional chemicals until a fully understand what is happening. Using Pool Math my CSI is within range.
    12,000 gallon 14 x 27 foot inground Stonescape mini-pebble plaster, Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 320 cartridge filter, Zodiac MX-8 suction pool sweep. Pool built in 2000, resurfaced August 2014. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Pentair Intellipro VS2 filter pump, 3/4 HP Whisperflo sheer descent waterfall pump, Intellichlor IC40 SWG generator ( the Intellipro and IC40 to be installed 05/28)

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Your TA is too high. Keep adding acid and aerating until you can lower it. Take it down to 80ppm to see if that helps. Go lower as needed. Do not go lower than 50ppm.

    Check your fill water. If it has high TA and you experience a lot of evaporation, you may need to consider controlling your evaporation rate to keep the addition of fill water low.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Mod Squad woodyp's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Aeration naturally raises the PH. The more water surface being broken--the faster it rises.
    16x32x52" Steel Cornelius Miramar AGP Vinyl liner 13,100 gal. Buried 2 ft.
    2 Speed Hayward Power-Flo Matrix 85 g.p.m. 22" 250lb. sand filter hard plumbed
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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Papahemi, Matt is explaining the technique for lowering TA in an effort to help keep pH low. But when I read your question, I get the feeling you are saying your pH "drops" more than you want it to. Or am I just mis-reading your scenario?
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    The PH is dropping without the addition of acid. PH drops to 7.0 then brought back up with aeration then drops again to 7.0.
    12,000 gallon 14 x 27 foot inground Stonescape mini-pebble plaster, Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 320 cartridge filter, Zodiac MX-8 suction pool sweep. Pool built in 2000, resurfaced August 2014. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Pentair Intellipro VS2 filter pump, 3/4 HP Whisperflo sheer descent waterfall pump, Intellichlor IC40 SWG generator ( the Intellipro and IC40 to be installed 05/28)

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    That's what I thought. Usually it's the other way around. Well, consider yourself somewhat fortunate I guess and continue to use natural aeration to your advantage. I'd be hesitant to increase TA at this point until the pool settle-in more later in the season. It may be an option later though. But definitely watch pH as you have been since too low is very corrosive. You're doing great by watching it.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Quote Originally Posted by Papahemi View Post
    The PH is dropping without the addition of acid. PH drops to 7.0 then brought back up with aeration then drops again to 7.0.
    Not to sound like Capt Obvious, but are you sure you're adding chlorine and not acid?

    Given your parameters I don't see how your water could drop that far in pH.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Given your parameters I don't see how your water could drop that far in pH.
    +1 what Matt is saying. something else is going on with testing error or some other variable.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Mod Squad woodyp's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Got any pucks in a floater some where?
    16x32x52" Steel Cornelius Miramar AGP Vinyl liner 13,100 gal. Buried 2 ft.
    2 Speed Hayward Power-Flo Matrix 85 g.p.m. 22" 250lb. sand filter hard plumbed
    Pool Rover Jr., Pool Blaster Max, Diver Dave TF100 Test Kit/Speed Stir
    Margaritaville Frozen Concoction Maker, Liqour Chiller, & Drink Mixer & Party Tub----Collect 'um all!

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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    No pucks will ever enter this pool again. Too many CYA problems in the past. Walmart Pool 10% liquid is the only chlorine I use.
    12,000 gallon 14 x 27 foot inground Stonescape mini-pebble plaster, Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 320 cartridge filter, Zodiac MX-8 suction pool sweep. Pool built in 2000, resurfaced August 2014. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Pentair Intellipro VS2 filter pump, 3/4 HP Whisperflo sheer descent waterfall pump, Intellichlor IC40 SWG generator ( the Intellipro and IC40 to be installed 05/28)

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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Just tested City water for TA. Got color change from green to slight red at 20. Full bright red at 30. Retested PH with new supply of regent R-0004. Reading 7.8-8-0. I will retest again tomorrow and post results. Thanks to all.
    12,000 gallon 14 x 27 foot inground Stonescape mini-pebble plaster, Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 320 cartridge filter, Zodiac MX-8 suction pool sweep. Pool built in 2000, resurfaced August 2014. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Pentair Intellipro VS2 filter pump, 3/4 HP Whisperflo sheer descent waterfall pump, Intellichlor IC40 SWG generator ( the Intellipro and IC40 to be installed 05/28)

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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Here are this mornings Test reading:
    FC-3.0
    PH-7.0
    TA-105
    CH-265
    CYA-40

    Turned on aeration for only five minutes to test amount of PH rise and PH went to 7.8 to 8.0. How is it possible that the PH can rise that fast in 17000 gallons of water? Does water stratify at different PH levels? Should I circulate the water before testing? I should also report that this PH swing from low to high to low to high was done without any chemical addition including 10% liquid chlorine.
    12,000 gallon 14 x 27 foot inground Stonescape mini-pebble plaster, Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 320 cartridge filter, Zodiac MX-8 suction pool sweep. Pool built in 2000, resurfaced August 2014. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Pentair Intellipro VS2 filter pump, 3/4 HP Whisperflo sheer descent waterfall pump, Intellichlor IC40 SWG generator ( the Intellipro and IC40 to be installed 05/28)

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Rather than focusing on the pH itself changing in only 5 minutes in a 17K pool, I would suspect there may be a bit of inconsistency in the body of water and that (yes) circulation would be ideal - perhaps 15-20 minutes of mixing prior to obtaining your sample.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Re: Stabilizing PH

    Here is what I have done and observed during the past week. I test in the evening around 6:00 PM about one hour after the filter cycle begins and make any additions at that time allowing the 8 hour filter cycle to disperse additions.. I now draw my water sample using the Taylor 2006 FAS/DPD test kit vial directly from the pool at different locations each day ( I was using a small plastic collection bottle. Did this make a difference, I doubt it). First day reading was 8.0 so using Pool Math I added acid to adjusted to 7.6. Tested the next day at same time,same method and PH was 7.4. Thought to myself why was it not closer to 7.6? Remeasured my pool and recalculated size and discovered my pool was 4000 Gal. less than my PB told me (adjusted my Poolmath). The PH pretty much stayed at 7.4 for the next couple of days. The FC dropped a little under 2 ppm each day so I am adding daily 10% to keep FC at 5 ppm with no indication of CC. TA still a little high at 110 ppm. CH still on low side at 270. Tested yesterday for Phosphates and got ZERO reading. On Monday I am having a new Intellipro VS 2 pump installed and I am converting to SWG with an Intellichlor IC40. Checking the TFP pool math I will have to get the TA down some more and the CH up some more. CYA is now at 40-50 ppm. After I have the work accomplish I will be working to bring all readings to TFP pool math levels. My CSI has always been within the Pool Math range. My thanks to all. Stay tuned more to come
    12,000 gallon 14 x 27 foot inground Stonescape mini-pebble plaster, Pentair Clean and Clear Plus 320 cartridge filter, Zodiac MX-8 suction pool sweep. Pool built in 2000, resurfaced August 2014. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Pentair Intellipro VS2 filter pump, 3/4 HP Whisperflo sheer descent waterfall pump, Intellichlor IC40 SWG generator ( the Intellipro and IC40 to be installed 05/28)

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