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Thread: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

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    TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    This is my 3rd summer of pool ownership with no previous opening, maintaining, or closing issues. Opened 6 weeks ago to a green pool. Cleared that up along with tons of worms and have had blue yet cloudy water for a month. Tired of pool store saying my levels are fine just need to keep "running the filter and it'll clear up." Here are my numbers as taken for the 2nd time with my TFP suggested TF100 testkit and speed stir(which I now greatly appreciate).

    C 1-2
    FC 1.5
    CH 250
    TA 120
    CYA 100+
    PH 7.2

    Thanks for any input
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Mod Squad zea3's Avatar
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Hi, welcome to TFP! You have very high CYA, which means your FC level is way too low. The recommended FC range for a CYA of 100 is 8-13ppm. Since your CYA is probably higher than 100 the minimum FC requirements are higher as well. At this point you are still fighting off algae and the pool will likely turn green again while the FC remains low.

    If draining and refilling is not an issue in your area, the best solution is a series of partial drain and refill cycles to get your CYA lowered. 30-50ppm is the recommended range for CYA. Since you have a vinyl liner pool, you must be careful not to drain too much water at once to avoid liner damage. Always leave at least 1 foot of water in the shallow end of the pool, more if you are in an area with a high water table or recent heavy rains. Drain as much as is appropriate for your groundwater situation, refill the pool and test again. It is possible that your CYA will still read very high after the first drain/refill cycle. This is why we say it will take a series of drain/refill cycles to lower the CYA in the pool.

    I wish I had better news for you, but this is necessary if your pool is going to be manageable. Feel free to ask any questions you may have.
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Welcome to TFP!

    You have really helped yourself by getting the test kit and it helps us get you going! So to start, your TA, pH and CH are fine. Wanted to start with the good news. Now your FC is very low for your CYA level. That is why your pool isn't clearing as the CYA is buffering your chlorine so much that it can't effectively kill the algae that is still in there. Algae is slowly dying but it has time to reproduce first and that is why the pool is staying cloudy.

    So Zea3 has the really bad news regarding CYA, so I will add even more CYA is added by using solid forms of chlorine. If you are using tablets to chlorinate and/or certain solid forms of chlorine to shock the pool then you are continuously adding more CYA. You will want to stick to liquid chlorine for getting rid of the algae and preferably for regular chlorine additions as well. This will help keep your CYA from getting out of control again in the future and make this water exchange a 1-time deal.
    JD - 28' Round Above Ground Pool, 17,000 Gallons. Dual speed Jacuzzi pump with cartridge filter. Dual speed 1 HP pump, Hayward S210T sand filter
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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Welcome to TFP!

    Good job!
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    I was afraid that was going to be the reply I got -- I'll check back in a week when my first drain/refill is complete... Thanks for the help
    I will be asking my pool store why they couldn't give me this info 3 weeks ago when the issue arose.
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    All the pool store is going to tell you is to not listen to a bunch of "amateurs" online and that your levels are fine. Then they will probably try to sell you some clarifier. Or, ugh, some BioActive.

    Best option is to let your wallet do the talking and not bring it anywhere near that place again.

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Quote Originally Posted by OJGLTY View Post
    I was afraid that was going to be the reply I got -- I'll check back in a week when my first drain/refill is complete... Thanks for the help
    I will be asking my pool store why they couldn't give me this info 3 weeks ago when the issue arose.
    Because the pool store doesn't understand the FC/CYA relationship. Period. If they did, they wouldn't push trichlor pucks and a weekly dichlor "shock".

    Then again, maybe they DO understand but it's a good business model to sell hundreds of dollars' worth of product to someone over the course of the year and then inform them they have high Total Dissolved Solids and need to drain and refill the pool now. Oh... and we have this pool startup kit that contains everything you need...

    Don't bother asking the pool store anything, Don't bother going in the pool store at all. You don't need their "free" testing any more. All the chemicals you'll likely need are readily available at big box stores. The pool store is only good for obscure bits of hardware now that you've jumped off the merry-go-round.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Copy that - cutting the pool store cord now...
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Have you tried diluting your water, then testing your CYA, to determine what it is actually at? 100+ can mean 150, or 400. Which one it is will make a difference on how many partial drains you will have to do. Do this to get an actual CYA we can use.

    Take some sort of a measuring cup, add mix equal parts of pool water, and tap water (like a cup of pool water, and a cup of tap water). Now, take that mixture, and test that water like you had just taken it from the pool. Whatever the CYA test shows, double that, and that will be your actual CYA. If the 50-50 diluted water is still showing over 100, then use 2 parts tap water, 1 part pool water, and multiply the test by 3. You need to keep diluting the water until you get a reading under 100, so we know what that level actually is.
    Bruce - (The SmartJack was an invention of mine, and became my nickname)
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Welcome to TFP OJGLTY

    It might take a while to get a handle on the chemistry but from personal experience I can tell you that you'll have cleaner water and it won't cost you the arm and a leg the pool store wants.
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Thanks smartjack - i wish i had checked back before starting my draining process immediately. Anyway I drained about 30 inches of water the first time and checked my CYA and it sat at 100 so i have a feeling it was closer to 120-130 originally. I drained as second time about 24 inches of water and refilled and here are my current numbers after running all day:
    FC 1.5
    CH 125
    TA 200
    CYA 75-80
    PH 7.5

    The pool is still cloudy although I can finally see the bottom of the deep end. Im assuming i should do this a third time but would like some input first. Thanks all.
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Lowering it further would probably be preferable, but if you are prepared to keep your FC over 6 at all times then you can get by at this CYA. That is your choice.

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Lowered it again! CYA now at 55.
    FC 5
    TA 200
    PH 7.5
    Looks like I'm ready to roll just wondering about the alkalinity. Assuming its not a huge deal since there arent any other numbers out of whack. Thanks for the help everyone - cant wait to enjoy the pool and not the pool store
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Hi,
    Your TA is high, but you can work it down over time. TA controls how quickly the pH rises.
    If your water is still cloudy, to a FC, CC and OCLT Test. if you need to SLAM, then go head and do it.
    Divin Dave,
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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    thanks dave. I lost 1.5 FC overnight so apparently algae is present and will SLAM starting today...updates and questions to come...off to read SLAM article
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    whens the best time to check FC once I add my chlorine? And after looking at older threads it appears swimming at shock level compared to CYA shouldnt be an issue, correct?
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Quote Originally Posted by OJGLTY View Post
    whens the best time to check FC once I add my chlorine? And after looking at older threads it appears swimming at shock level compared to CYA shouldnt be an issue, correct?
    When depends on whether or not it's normal day-to-day or if you're performing a SLAM. Routinely, the best time is 24 hours since you added last, after the pump has been running at least half an hour. Unless you suspect some bad bleach, there's no reason to verify what you've added any sooner than that.

    During a SLAM, recheck after the first hour and if you lost more than half, an hour after that. If less than half, stretch it to every two or three hours.

    It is safe to swim up to shock levels for your CYA. You might experience more eye irritation and it may shorten the life of the swimsuits.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: TFP noob- sick of pool store- looking for guidance

    Got it thanks Richard. I did just start SLAMing a few hours ago and wanted to get a starting FC so I know how much I might be losing over the course of the day
    32k IG vinyl liner - Titan 48' DE Filter - Hayward 1HP Superpump _ TF100 test kit with speed stir - Pool owner as of 2014

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