IC40 vs IC60: I could use a little help here.

[pisymbol]

No. That's the variable FLOW pump. I have the variable SPEED (think RPMs) pump.

Does one have an advantage over the other? People seem to think the FLOW pump is better, not sure.

I don't know the exact flow spec for the SWG off hand. Perhaps others do but it's usually pretty low.

Also, the IntelliChlor's chlorine output is INDEPENDENT of flow rate. An IC60 generates 2lbs of chlorine gas per day FULL STOP. It doesn't matter if your flowing water just above the cutoff flow rate or at the highest speed possible.

Got it. So without the Easytouch, is the IC-60/powercell on a manual timer while my IF would be on its own but they are BOTH on the same power supply?

WAIT A MINUTE: If the IC-60 generates a fixed rate of chlorine gas, what does the percentage on it adjust?

 

[RobbieH]

Almost everyone here will recommend the VS over the VF. I did not listen, I wanted to be able to plug in my criteria and have it all figured out for me. But now that I know what I know, if I were to do it all over again, I would get the lowest price VS.

Why?
1. The VS is a lot cheaper, and if you understand or can calculate the efficiency at different speeds, it is easy to do the same thing with a VS.
2. The VF is intent on keeping a certain flow rate. This can be a problem if you have something blocking the path. It will push and push to get the water flowing, which could cause a plumbing issue.
3. The VF (from what I am told) will not work with solar panels.

There are probably more reasons, but those are the ones that come to mind.

 

[pisymbol]

Almost everyone here will recommend the VS over the VF. I did not listen, I wanted to be able to plug in my criteria and have it all figured out for me. But now that I know what I know, if I were to do it all over again, I would get the lowest price VS.

Why?
1. The VS is a lot cheaper, and if you understand or can calculate the efficiency at different speeds, it is easy to do the same thing with a VS.
2. The VF is intent on keeping a certain flow rate. This can be a problem if you have something blocking the path. It will push and push to get the water flowing, which could cause a plumbing issue.
3. The VF (from what I am told) will not work with solar panels.

There are probably more reasons, but those are the ones that come to mind.

I assume then something like this would do.

Question, how do you backwash with a VS pump? The clean mode?

EDIT: Googling says set max speed to 2000rpm and go from there.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Got it. So without the Easytouch, is the IC-60/powercell on a manual timer while my IF would be on its own but they are BOTH on the same power supply?

WAIT A MINUTE: If the IC-60 generates a fixed rate of chlorine gas, what does the percentage on it adjust?

You want to wire the IntelliChlor so that it is never powered on UNLESS the pump has power.

The % Output is the duty cycle of the cell. So, if you set the output to 50% that means the IC will generate chlorine for 30mins and then shut off for 30mins.

The minimum flow rate of an IntelliChlor is 25GPM.

 

[pisymbol]

You want to wire the IntelliChlor so that it is never powered on UNLESS the pump has power.

I understand that. But that means the pump will have to prime first before there is actual flow. I assume that is OK.

The % Output is the duty cycle of the cell. So, if you set the output to 50% that means the IC will generate chlorine for 30mins and then shut off for 30mins.

So before, when you said it was not based on flow its all based on percentage in terms of the amount of chlorine I will get per day. 100% would give me the full 2 pounds in a 24 hour period, right?

Finally, when you say you would have to time the IF rate with the IC what does that mean? I thought you meant I could program the IF to go really really low as to trip the flow sensor in the IC to not generate chlorine during this part of the day. That would be my automatic way to adjust IC with the IF.

But then you said it makes no difference what the flow is, it's based on the IC's set percentage. But how does one adjust the IC percentage on a timer? i.e. how do you dial in the IC and IF if the pump has the timer.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

I understand that. But that means the pump will have to prime first before there is actual flow. I assume that is OK.

If your plumbing is done correctly, your pump basket should not lose water and go dry. If it does, then something is not right.

The IntelliFlo runs up it's speed at start-up to the highest speed setting until it senses full prime and then it drops down to whatever speed it is programmed to run at. If you pump basket fails to prime with water, it will stop and wait a minute and then try again. It will do this several times and then error-out if pump prime can not be achieved.

When the IntelliChlor first powers up, it runs through a 2-3minute startup/warmup cycle where it waits for water flow and temperature to equilibrate, it checks salinity level and then it powers on the cell for whatever the programmed output is. So you don't have to worry too much about startup.

So before, when you said it was not based on flow its all based on percentage in terms of the amount of chlorine I will get per day. 100% would give me the full 2 pounds in a 24 hour period, right?

Yes, that is correct.

Finally, when you say you would have to time the IF rate with the IC what does that mean? I thought you meant I could program the IF to go really really low as to trip the flow sensor in the IC to not generate chlorine during this part of the day. That would be my automatic way to adjust IC with the IF.

Yes, that is correct. If you run the IntelliFlo at a low enough speed, the flow rate will drop below 25GPM and the IntelliChlor will throw a LOW FLOW alarm (red LED light). The IC will stop producing chlorine to protect itself from low flow. Once the flow rate increases above the cut-off value, it will resume chlorine production. The amount of chlorine produced is independent of flow rate once you get ABOVE the cut-off value.

But then you said it makes no difference what the flow is, it's based on the IC's set percentage. But how does one adjust the IC percentage on a timer? i.e. how do you dial in the IC and IF if the pump has the timer.

This is why having an EasyTouch automation panel is somewhat advisable. The EasyTouch comes pre-wired with all the correct interlocks and data communication cables for running an IntelliFlo along with an IntelliChlor. If you just buy the IF and IC separately, then you have to power them with the same mechanical timer relay (just pull the stops out and let it stay on). In your case, you'd have the IF and IC powered on all the time. The IntellifFlo will control the pump runtime schedules (what times of the day you want the pump to run) and pump speeds. The IC will sit there idle but powered up basically waiting for the flow rate to become high enough so that it can kick in. It's a very non-optimal way to wire the units up and run them but that's what you have to do when you run them without an EasyTouch panel.

 

[Philo]

delete...

 

[pisymbol]

This is why having an EasyTouch automation panel is somewhat advisable. The EasyTouch comes pre-wired with all the correct interlocks and data communication cables for running an IntelliFlo along with an IntelliChlor. If you just buy the IF and IC separately, then you have to power them with the same mechanical timer relay (just pull the stops out and let it stay on). In your case, you'd have the IF and IC powered on all the time. The IntellifFlo will control the pump runtime schedules (what times of the day you want the pump to run) and pump speeds. The IC will sit there idle but powered up basically waiting for the flow rate to become high enough so that it can kick in. It's a very non-optimal way to wire the units up and run them but that's what you have to do when you run them without an EasyTouch panel.

Let's say I get the EasyTouch. How easy is it? Really? I have no experience with an automation system. It looks very complicated.

Also can I switch over to ET if I wanted to later int he season by buying just the panel?

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Let's say I get the EasyTouch. How easy is it? Really? I have no experience with an automation system.

Why don't you call Pentair and talk to them directly. Given that your pool has no spa attached to it and no valves that need automation (like a water feature), then you'd probably be better off with a SunTouch system to tie a pump and SWG together. You could then use it to automate a pool light if need be and it can be used with a QuickTouch 4 button remote. You'd still have to buy the external IntelliChlor Power Center but you have to buy that anyway. The SunTouch system will then tie all of your equipment together.

If your sure you want Pentair, then calling them will be the most efficient way to get all of your questions answered and they can provide with a custom built package for your needs.

 

[pisymbol]

Thanks Matt. I owe you many beers and I thank you for your time.

I think I will but I also think I'm gonna skip doing the SWG this year. I'm just not ready at this point. I believe I fully understand the chemical aspect (the easy part), but setting this up in my pool, getting everything installed is going to take weeks. My PB isn't exactly an expert on this stuff either.

I thought I could do the IF/IC combo and that would just "work" and it will, just not optimally.

I could do the IC-60 (I don't do the Hayward because it's frankly not big enough) and keep my pump, but that means I will probably be running it at least 50-60% of the time for 12 hours which I'm not too keen on given my Hayward.

 

[TeamNelson]

I have the Easy Touch control panel and the Pentair APP "Screen Logic" & I would do it again!!! Invest in the automation as my friend with his SWG does NOT have the automation and the 20% increments do not allow him to keep a steady FC reading. He is very frustrated that he got a SWG and now is either getting rid of it or getting the automation. As stated you get 1% incremental adjustments with the automation panel & the Screen Logic App. I can read my Salt level and adjust everything (pump programming, heat the spa, check on the temperatures and more)from work on the road as I travel extensively for my job.

 

[pisymbol]

I have the Easy Touch control panel and the Pentair APP "Screen Logic" & I would do it again!!! Invest in the automation as my friend with his SWG does NOT have the automation and the 20% increments do not allow him to keep a steady FC reading. He is very frustrated that he got a SWG and now is either getting rid of it or getting the automation. As stated you get 1% incremental adjustments with the automation panel & the Screen Logic App. I can read my Salt level and adjust everything (pump programming, heat the spa, check on the temperatures and more)from work on the road as I travel extensively for my job.

I hear ya! But at this point, I'm just not ready. At this point, I'd still prefer a more simple system.