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Thread: Filling Pool from Lake Water

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    Filling Pool from Lake Water

    With the assistance of this site (and some great contributors) I was able to test my pool and determine that the pool needs to be drained in order to lower the CYA. The CYA value is ~200ppm so I will be draining/refilling 75% of the pool with lake water as I have well.

    My question is, what do I need to test the lake water for prior to starting. I currently have the K2006 test kit and can test for alkalinity, pH, and hardness. I also picked up the Seachem MultiTest Iron Test Kit from Amazon and will be able to test for iron upon arrival. Anything I am missing?

    Thanks in Advance.

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    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Copper is unlikely, unless it is a lake that does a coordinated copper sulfate addition as some lake associations do, thought that trend is decreasing. Wouldn't hurt to test for that as well.

    An inline filter to remove larger particles would be nice. Don't need anything fancy. Be prepared with plenty of bleach as their will be a fair amount of organic material in the lake water.

    Update your signature with your pool details when you can.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Signature is updated. We do not have a lake association, hopefully in the clear on the Copper. I will test the alkalinity, pH, and hardness tonight and post the results.
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Unless you have staining on your liner, I think it's safe to say you do not have excessive iron or copper. The water will come in dirty but by backwashing and rinsing your filter, I think it will be a success. As JV says, Keep plenty of chlorine around and prepare to vacuum and brush.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    I have the result from the lake water. pH is below the k2006 reading but the strips estimate about a 6.2, TA of 20ppm, and hardness at 30ppm. I also have a calcium build up on the bottom of my pool. Should I attack the calcium with the low pH or raise the pH and go for the slam treatment?

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Raise the PH to 7.2 with Borax or washing soda, both available on the laundry aisle, more here on what they are and how to add them to your pool. Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals

    Enter 7.2 in Poolmath for the Target and 6.8 in Now, add what it says with the pump running wait 15 minutes or so, retest and add again until PH shows up in the test and holds at 7.2. Then SLAM, Pool School - SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    My question is, what do I need to test the lake water for prior to starting. I currently have the K2006 test kit and can test for alkalinity, pH, and hardness. I also picked up the Seachem MultiTest Iron Test Kit from Amazon and will be able to test for iron upon arrival.
    If you have the Taylor K-2006, you should be able to test for
    FC
    CC
    TC
    CH
    CYA
    pH
    TA

    Post those numbers up and tell us if your pool is vinyl, fibreglass? masonry?

    We can give more help but you have some things to sort out first.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    I was able to turn the pool over 3 times this weekend. Once turned over the values were as follows:

    FC - 0
    CC - 0
    TC - 0
    CH - 20
    CYA - 30
    pH - 6.5
    TA - 30

    I then raised the alkalinity to 80ppm and targeted a 7 pH but overshot to 7.6. I then added two gallons of 12.5% bleach which raised the FC to 12. I will continue to hold the FC there until the pool passes the OCLT.

    I am still unsure what to do with the "calcium" build it. The build up makes it very difficult to move the vacuum as it creates a great deal of friction. It is a vinyl pool so acid wash is out of the question. Any other recommendations?
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Are you certain that it's calcium build up? Usually in a vinyl pool you'll only see calcium scale at the waterline if CSI is maintained too high for a long period. Your numbers, although after a new refill don't look like they have a chance at causing scaling. What does the scaling on the bottom look like? Flat and sandpaper looking or jagged and crystalline? If you could get some off and get a picture of it, that may help. Also, after taking a picture of it, put it in a glass dish and drip a little muriatic acid on it. If it bubbles, it's calcium. Otherwise it could be a sulfates build up if a powdered pH down product (sodium bisulfate) was used for long periods of time.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    I am not certain it is calcium, I only suspected that from reading through this site. This is my first season with the pool as I recently purchased the home. The material was present when I opened the pool last week. I do not remember seeing it there when we toured the house last fall (previous owners closed the pool)

    It looks and feels like sandpaper, slightly raised off the vinyl. I attempted to remove some material but it is stuck on to the bottom of the pool. I tried taking some pictures but they did not come out good at all. I also tried to swim down some low pH water which I made from pH minus (MA) and water. It did not seem to affect it at all, but then again who knows if i was able to get the water down before it dispersed.

    If is is a sulfate build up is there someway I can test or remove it?
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Now that you've raised the TA a bit, if you drop the pH down to 7.0-7.2 and really scrub at it with a pool brush it may come loose. A higher TA with a low pH might will allow the scale to dissolve more readily if it is calcium.

    The sulfates are more of a long shot really. They tend to be jagged and crystalline and don't adhere as firmly to vinyl from what I remember reading about.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
    Isolated Spa - 345 Gallons

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Ok I will try this out. I will need to wait until my FC comes down so I can get an accurate pH reading. Since I just started the SLAM process I wont be able to start this until after my water turns from its current green color to clear and I pass the OCLT. I will keep you posted with my progress.
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Sorry for the delay. The SLAM went well and the water is now crystal clear! Everything went as planned, thanks for all the help. I have lowered the ph to 7.2 but the white material is not budging from the walls, is there anything else I can do?
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Quote Originally Posted by obaro15 View Post
    I am not certain it is calcium, I only suspected that from reading through this site. This is my first season with the pool as I recently purchased the home. The material was present when I opened the pool last week. I do not remember seeing it there when we toured the house last fall (previous owners closed the pool)

    It looks and feels like sandpaper, slightly raised off the vinyl. I attempted to remove some material but it is stuck on to the bottom of the pool. I tried taking some pictures but they did not come out good at all. I also tried to swim down some low pH water which I made from pH minus (MA) and water. It did not seem to affect it at all, but then again who knows if i was able to get the water down before it dispersed.

    If is is a sulfate build up is there someway I can test or remove it?
    Is your liner faded in this area? I'm assuming when you say the "bottom of the pool" this is the flat surface of the deep end?
    You may not have anything stuck to the liner at all, could be the base material - typically vermiculite or sand washed away due to ground water table.

    You've used lake water to refill, so I'm curious what the lake water level is in relation to the grade of the pool.
    If the pool water level was ever lowered below the lake level, ground water can push behind the liner, once the level raised to normal the water is forced somewhere - and it can take the vermiculite with it.

    This could be exacerbated if the main drain(assuming the pool has one) ever leaked, it would wash away the fine smoothing sands and leave aggregate pebbles which will press through the liner and give a rough appearance.
    30k in ground vinyl lined pool surrounded by decking in the woods.
    Hayward sand filter circa mid 80's
    If there is a way to do things less expensively and yield a superior product I am all ears

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    The liner is covered with a white material, it does not appear faded. The lake is roughly 40 ft lower then the pool and there is no main drain. This white residue was not present in Sept, then the pool was closed by the previous owner. We found the material present upon opening the pool this spring.

    A minimal amount of the residue has been removed from vaccumming and brushing but again it has been minimal.
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Quote Originally Posted by obaro15 View Post
    The liner is covered with a white material, it does not appear faded. The lake is roughly 40 ft lower then the pool and there is no main drain. This white residue was not present in Sept, then the pool was closed by the previous owner. We found the material present upon opening the pool this spring.

    A minimal amount of the residue has been removed from vaccumming and brushing but again it has been minimal.
    I would gander a guess that cheap di-chlor(shock) was broadcast into the pool prior to closing, without being pre-dissolved. Any remnants of chemicals left in a shed/garage from the PO?
    If a pH down granular product was used, I'm not sure it would eat into and bind to the liner.

    The shock will usually bleach the liner out if it sat there all winter.
    Most of my reasoning is your CYA levels were 250+ to start(prior to the lake water change out)
    The bags of shock at wally-world contain di-chlor, and pucks tri-chlor, break down into cyuranic acid(CYA)and FC amongst other things
    30k in ground vinyl lined pool surrounded by decking in the woods.
    Hayward sand filter circa mid 80's
    If there is a way to do things less expensively and yield a superior product I am all ears

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Ohh that does not sound good.... No chemicals are left over. Anything I can do to test if it is di-chlor? Can I fix it if it is?
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    The white material is there now? Can you brush it to dissolve it? Vacuum it? Scoop it our with a net?
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Yes the white material is still present and stuck to the liner floor. A minimal amount has been removed via vacuuming/brushing but nothing substantial. The little bit that has been removed was either dissolved or vacuumed out. Again this was a very insignificant amount. I even tried to hand scrub it by diving to the bottom and it refuses to let go.
    16 x 32 Inground Vinyl Pool installed in 1987, Hayward Sand Filter (S244T), Single Speed Hayward 3/4 HP SuperPump, K-2006 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Filling Pool from Lake Water

    Interesting, I don't have any idea what it could be. But insignificant amount sounds good!
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