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Thread: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

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    Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    SO, everything was going SOOOOO well - (see my other posts on my install as a newbie). Pool was perfectly level, pump was tested and worked great - just got my TF100 kit yesterday and was going to start fooling around with it today - but we still needed to put another 4 inches or so of water in to finish the fill.

    Turned on the hose - was VERY close to done - SNAP! Lost 2 pavers on one side:

    Attachment 47171

    Am I screwed? Meaning do I have to drain and redo everything? Or is there a fix for this - I guess the obvious first one is to go to treated wood at least for these two when replacing - but I am really hoping there is a way to dig, lift with a hydro jack or something so I don't have to drain....

    Help!

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    From what I can see, you're putting point loads on the pavers at the edges, rather than distributing the load across the whole tile (not that the thin tile would do much better with that weight distributed across it's surface), so the fracture was inevitable (and will happen at the other tiles as well). Or am I misreading the photo? Looks like the bottom bar has an arc and does not lie flat across the tile surface.
    Geebot
    Chicago, IL
    30K gal, InGround Plaster Finish, 3.5'-9.5', Maytronics S300 Cleaner

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    GEE - yes you are correct - but from what I read/saw here many others use these pavers for their AGP installations. Not exactly sure why mine caved - but at this point I need to decide a course of action.

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Geebot is right. you need a tile on each end of that support....not one tile in the middle.

    Can you lift that upright and get tiles under it??? I am not sure. Maybe make a fulcrum with a 2x6 but it may not be strong enough.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Your pavers look a little thin. How thick are those? Mine are 50mm (2") and have not broken. Did you make sure the surface under the pavers is completely level and tampered, so that the entire surface of the paver is supported? Agree with previous poster that it looks like there is an arc at the bottom of the first leg. Is that the case or just an illusion?
    Last edited by Mickelin; 04-28-2016 at 02:01 AM. Reason: Error in metric conversion
    Intex Ultra Frame 24'x12'x52" (732cm x 366cm) rectangular pool
    Intex SF80220RC (1600 GPH) pump/sandfilter
    Intex SF10220 (1050 GPH) pump/sandfilter driving the
    Intex Automatic Pool Cleaner
    Intex 8220 ECO SWG, Brilix XHP100 9kW heatpump

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    I have just started draining - I will need to order another leg that is damaged - I think what happened was the ground got wet near the pump when testing and that started a chain reaction and adding the last few inches of water was the final straw. The legs need to be ordered from Intex right - nobody carries those in stock at walmart or anything - right?

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    titleistseemore's Avatar
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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    correct, the legs are not a part carried by the stores. What a bummer ...
    Tim Jacobsen Lodi Ca.
    18'x48" Intex Ultra Frame (5700 Gallons)
    TF 100 Test Kit, Speedstir, & Sample Sizer. Liquidator Installed.
    Hayward C550 Cartridge Filter (55 Sq. Ft.), 1HP Powerflo LX Pump, Pool Rover Jr.
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...uild-Questions

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    So - on the repair path - not the end of the world - 35.00 including shipping for the leg (anybody know where intex ships out of? I know they are HQ in Los Angeles) - draining slowly - no big hurry since I have to wait for leg anyway - and then do it right this weekend. I ll survive.

    Do you think my ground/sand base will be good enough? I am thinking maybe I just drain until I can manipulate the legs enough to put the new support in and replace the pavers (I ll probably replace them all with wood to be safe).

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    You need 2"+ pavers for these rectangular intex pools. I know there was a discussion about this very issue last year because pavers were snapping left n right. You just can not use the 1" pavers.

    I ran a search and it looks like 16"x16"x4" pavers were used. You can use the search bar at the top right of the page. Just type in what you want n go.
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    I had to order two legs from Intex, don't remember where they came from but they were fast, I think 2 days and they told me it might be 5-7. I'm in Florida
    Intex 16x48" Ultra Frame AG Swimming Pool 5K gal
    intex 2650 sand filter

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Thanks Cooljul. Anybody have thoughts on how far I need to go here? I want to do what is needed - do I just need to drain completely, take the pool apart, recheck the base, and build the pool again?

    I have a hard packed tampered earth base with just about 2" of sand over that and as you recall I was literally PERFECT on level until this happened. I am wondering which is worse - moving the pool etc may disturb it more than just draining until I can re-adjust and put new pavers or wood blocks under the legs?

    What a pain - but my own fault.

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Well if we couldn't do it twice it wouldn't be any fun I agree with what Dave and Casey said. If it were me I would go with at least 2" pavers, either one under the outside of each leg or the big pavers that would cover the entire leg area thus spreading out the load over a bigger area. That's what we did when we had an above ground years ago. If my memory serves me, I think that we lowered the water level enough to keep the bottom of the liner in place and that should allow you to replace each paver one at a time. If your sure you were dead on level (I bet you were) than just make sure you get the new pavers in deep enough if going thicker and you should still be level. If I lived closer I would come over and help... keep the lid on the cooler from blowing open. Good luck, let us know how it goes

    P.S- I put a paver between each leg and used a 2x6 from the paver and top rail to create just enough lift to raise leg. Just don't bend the top rail
    Si -central Mo. 32' x 16' -- 3'4" to 6' deep Vinyl liner - 16,500 Gals : Triton II filter -Duraglass 2 hp pump - 1 speed : SI-30 salt generator
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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    You need to turn the pavers 90 degrees so that the entire leg is supported by the paver, not just the centre section. That is why they snapped like that, the force was acting like a scissor on each side.
    You may want to put thicker pavers or pressure treated wood under each one to help support it as well.
    Ultra 16', Intex Sand filter/pump combo, 8' x 20' solar panels, solar blanket w/roll tube, 1" extruded foam floor with Gorilla pad, Liquid chlorine and stabilizer.

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickelin View Post
    Did you make sure the surface under the pavers is completely level and tampered, so that the entire surface of the paver is supported?
    I was wondering the same thing. Look at the top most paver in the picture, it looks like it isn't completely flat on the ground which could really lead to breaking.
    Intex Ultra Frame 26'x52"
    Intex 2,500 gal/hr pump with Unicel cartridge filter.

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    The earth under the pavers was level and tampered - BUT, then it got wet - combined with my too weak and/or improperly positioned pavers and this is the result. I won't make the same mistake again. But, we are only drained about 8" so far which again is fine - not so much attention drawn on the street and I have to wait for the new support anyway - but am still open to any suggestions as to starting the process earlier (before draining the entire pool I mean).

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Were the legs damaged when the pavers broke or did faulty legs cause the break? I get a bit concerned when you say everything was fine, but then the ground got wet... The base needs to be stable enough to handle a lot of water, even in AZ. Maybe you should consider digging out 4-5" and fill with packed gravel, then sand, at least under the pavers?
    Intex Ultra Frame 24'x12'x52" (732cm x 366cm) rectangular pool
    Intex SF80220RC (1600 GPH) pump/sandfilter
    Intex SF10220 (1050 GPH) pump/sandfilter driving the
    Intex Automatic Pool Cleaner
    Intex 8220 ECO SWG, Brilix XHP100 9kW heatpump

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    I've never installed that type of pool, but it seems pretty odd to me that there could be anything close to enough force on those legs to break a paver like that. I know the liner stretches so some of the water weight transfers to the legs, but I regularly drive a farm tractor over those kind of pavers and have never had a crack.
    TFP Moderator
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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnT View Post
    I've never installed that type of pool, but it seems pretty odd to me that there could be anything close to enough force on those legs to break a paver like that. I know the liner stretches so some of the water weight transfers to the legs, but I regularly drive a farm tractor over those kind of pavers and have never had a crack.
    A tractor's relatively soft tire will distribute the tractor's weight across the surface of the tile. If the tile is adequately supported from below then the weight will be transmitted to the earth below. Take off the tire and rest the edge of the bare rim on the paver and then see what happens. MOST of the water weight transfers to the ground through the legs. If that's a 10,000 gallon pool then you're carrying 80,000 lbs of water weight with each of 8 leg assemblies taking 10,000 lbs. because the bottom of the leg assembly is arched each leg transmits 5,000 lbs to its support below (and having it occur on opposite edges of the paver nearly assures a break). That will cause a thin paver to snap.
    Geebot
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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    I think your math might be a little off. I'd bet 95% of the water weight is on the ground, not the legs, that would put 500# per assembly, not 10,000#. Also tractor tires with the tread puts the weight on about an inch wide spot across the tire, it's not really spread out.
    Intex Ultra Frame 26'x52"
    Intex 2,500 gal/hr pump with Unicel cartridge filter.

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    Re: Broken Pavers - am I screwed?!

    Quote Originally Posted by krazykrames View Post
    I think your math might be a little off. I'd bet 95% of the water weight is on the ground, not the legs, that would put 500# per assembly, not 10,000#. Also tractor tires with the tread puts the weight on about an inch wide spot across the tire, it's not really spread out.
    Is the liner actually sitting on the ground? I know very little about above-ground pools of this type. I assumed the liner is suspended and doesn't actually reach the ground; if it does then the legs are still carrying a substantial amount of weight, certainly more than 5% (there's a lot of force resisting the lateral pressure of the water on the liner).
    Geebot
    Chicago, IL
    30K gal, InGround Plaster Finish, 3.5'-9.5', Maytronics S300 Cleaner

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