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Thread: Filling now , please help with startup

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    Filling now , please help with startup

    Plaster crew finished yesterday afternoon , diamond brite bahama breeze was used
    pool is now filling , and since my builder has pretty much ditched me , I am on my own.
    Plasterers added sequestrant (4 bottles of startup tec)
    I have several questions , I'm assuming the acid startup is the way to go ?
    on the plaster startup page it says , do not run pump at first , how long before I turn it on after adding muratic?
    after I initially add MA , do I then start pump , and start brushing ? But add nothing else until most of the dust has cleared ? Even if this takes a week , or two ?
    So sorry for sounding like a dummy , but am just a little freaked out and overwhelmed. This pool build has almost broken me down , and have had to learn and stress a whole lot over the last few weeks.
    at what point should I start adding other chemicals , suggestions greatly appreciated.

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    Good morning Turbo. While you feel somewhat abandoned there, it is very important you continue to try and contact the builder about the start-up. The last thing you want to happen is to void any warranty work because something didn't go as planned. Try to find out if they have any preference about an acid versus traditional start-up process. If needed, get something in writing to protect yourself for future reference. But if everything is on you now, stick with the Pool School - Start-up New Plaster page. As for the pump question, you'll see in the acid start-up section that it only remains off until you've successfully dissolved the plaster dust. That's the part where you add the initial acid dosage to dissolve the plaster dust then brush daily until it all settles. Once that has happened, then you neutralize the acid with soda ash/washing soda and adjust pH to at least 7.2. THEN you can turn-on the pump to start circulating everything. From there you can also start adding chlorine, stabilizer, etc to balance the water.

    It's overwhelming at first, but just stick to that page and go over it slowly and carefully and it will guide you through it. But have that process memorized for when you call them in case they want to modify any of those steps.

    Let us know if you still have some questions. Good luck!
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    Pat has you covered for the care of your start up..............I want to touch on the testing. Do you have a good test kit yet? If not look in my siggy for the one that is the best bang for the buck. PLEASE do not rely on the pool store. We have found their testing to be more wrong than right . You have already spent this much on the pool now is the time to invest in a good test kit.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    Are you sure the Plasterers are done? When I had a pool re-plastered, they gave me a very detailed list of things I needed to do.

    For the pool that I recently had installed at my house, they went through a three or four day sequence of start up...

    I would contact the people that plastered your pool, as they are the ones that have to do any warranty failures, and ask them exactly what they want you to do.

    Jim R.
    Finished in 2015 - 17K Gal, IG, 20' x 25' Almost Rectangular Pool, Pebble finish, three rockport water falls. Pentair Equipment: EasyTouch 4, IC40 SWG, 3 HP VS Pump, CCP520 Cartridge Filter.
    TF100 with SpeedStir and SampleSizer, ColorQ Pro 7, Dolphin Premier Robot Cleaner, added Screen Logic 2, added small 3 person Calder Spa.

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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    I do have the test kit , and I am on my own . Problem is , I used a somewhat free lance guy , so basically did it to myself I guess .
    i am fuzzy on the start up page .
    Sorry to be so sketchy .
    i fill the pool completely, then add my MA right away , (approx 38k to 40k gallons ) so I am going with around 14 gallons?
    I brush right away , and continue to do so for a few days , any idea of how long this will be ,
    1 -3 days , 3-5?

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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    I spoke to him briefly about procedures , and he said that normally the pool companies that he worked for took over once the filling process began .
    I think his two main accounts are blue haven and another large builder in my area .
    I will ask him, when I pay him . But as of right now , I am just going to rely on me , and this great site !

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    You are in an unusual situation. No problem. If you end-up continuing on your own, just stick the start-up page. To answer your question - yes, acid right away since they already added sequestrant. 3 1/2 gallons muriatic acid per 10,000 gallons and then brush the entire pool, so (yes) that would be about 14 gallons for 40K. Brush twice daily but don't vacuum or add chlorine until plaster dust is gone. How long with that take? Every pool is different, but I would think the 1-3 days for that portion before the dust is all dissolved and you begin to add the neutralize the acid with soda ash/washing soda to neutralize the acid. Try to look at it as "one step at a time" for start-up so you don't get overwhelmed. First order or business is dissolving the plaster dust followed by neutralizing the acid and pH adjustment so you can start the pump. You'll get there.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    Quote Originally Posted by Texas Splash View Post
    You are in an unusual situation. No problem. If you end-up continuing on your own, just stick the start-up page. To answer your question - yes, acid right away since they already added sequestrant. 3 1/2 gallons muriatic acid per 10,000 gallons and then brush the entire pool, so (yes) that would be about 14 gallons for 40K. Brush twice daily but don't vacuum or add chlorine until plaster dust is gone. How long with that take? Every pool is different, but I would think the 1-3 days for that portion before the dust is all dissolved and you begin to add the neutralize the acid with soda ash/washing soda to neutralize the acid. Try to look at it as "one step at a time" for start-up so you don't get overwhelmed. First order or business is dissolving the plaster dust followed by neutralizing the acid and pH adjustment so you can start the pump. You'll get there.
    indeed I am in a very strange predicament , but , again it is my own fault . My wife would have rather just called a company and have them tells when they were done and we can swim.
    Me on the other hand has to overthink it , and say buy doing this this and this , we can maximize features ,size and so on .

    what brush should I buy to brush ? Standard pool brush ? Or some other ?

    i am in the industrial trade , so I will be able to buy my MA in 5 gallon buckets ,
    i have a chemical company that we deal with that has this ,
    mad well as strong bleach - 15-17% from what I am told . I need to figure out how much of that I need to buy as well and go ahead and pick it up too , as well as soda ash .
    Good recommendation as a starting point ?

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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    I would stick to a standard brush for now. You probably don't want to use aggressive steel bristles until much later when you know the plaster has cured completely. Having a good source for MA and chlorine is great. The bleach will be used everyday to "feed" your pool sanitizer. At that % strength, a few gallons should get you started and last a while if they hold their strength. I would suggest at this point getting familiar with the Poolmath Calculator (link below) and experimenting with those items/rows. For example, on the FC row, you'll enter a NOW and TARGET/GOAL number. For bleach specifically, you have to manually enter the percentage you have on-hand, then at the top it will tell you how much to add to reach that goal/target. It's a great tool that will save you a lot of time. As for raising the pH (when it's time), you can use Borax which is available as 20 Mule TeamŽ Borax Natural Laundry Booster. It is sold in the laundry detergent section of most larger grocery stores.

    But for now, focus on the plaster dust and acid with brushing a couple times each day until it all disappears. As soon as that's done and you adjust pH back to 7.2, then we can get some bleach/chlorine in there to keep that water clear.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    Great , so do not buy soda ash ?
    i will be running a SWG when it's time also

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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    PH can be raised in three ways: borax, soda ash, and aeration. Borax is usually the best choice. But if you see soda ash for a better price, that works too. As for the SWG, don't turn it on for at least 30 days. That plaster dust and gunk needs to settle and get filtered out really well so that you don't clog/damage your SWG cells. After you take care of the plaster dust and we get ready to chlorinate, you will simply manually chlorinate for about a month until the SWG can be turned-on.

    Oh, one last supply item ... stabilizer! You can get granule stabilizer at Wal-Mart, or the hardware store pool sections. Active ingredient is cyanuric acid. Better get a couple jugs of that (about $16 each) so you can be prepared to add it at the same time we begin to chlorinate. The stabilizer protects your new chlorine when we start adding it.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    I cannot thank you all enough !
    i have my brush ,
    MA
    Bleachand went ahead and took the bag of soda just because I had already called in( and it was $18
    but will grab some borax as well!

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    Nice work! Thanks for supporting TFP!
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    So I poured in my MA this evening , and started brushing , this is a lot of work !
    had a function to go to for my son , got done a few hours later , decided to brush again.
    i called my builder , and he actually answered . Commences to tell me that I need to go buy a SS bristle brush, an brush the heck out of it . Kept stressing how much I needed to brush , but only said that I should add about two gallons of Acid .
    Told me that I need to be running my pump 24/7 for now and just backwash often .
    i did not tell him what I have learned here , just listened to what he said.
    he did mention that no matter what anyone else said , I needed to keep my calcium at 200 parts per million.

    i did get my wife to test water and the ph is really low , like 4.5 ? Showed pale yellow on scale.
    calcium was at 100ppm.

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    CH will be increased just as soon as the plaster battle settles. pH is naturally now because of the intense acid dumps. But once you are past the initial plaster dust battle, you will immediately raise that pH to the minimum 7.2 and crank everything up - and filter often. Have a nice day.

    Oh, and just to confirm for you, I got this from another expert's thread some time ago:
    Yes, there are wire brushes for use on plaster pools. You don't want to use a wire brush on plaster while it is curing, but after the first several months a wire, or mixed wire and nylon, brush is the way to go.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Re: Filling now , please help with startup

    My instructions for my pebble pool, left by the installers, were to use a nylon brush, not a steel brush. I also needed to brush 3 times a day for the first 3 days and then twice a day for the next 10 days. I'm not sure if you have a pebble finish, but in any case maybe this will help.
    Marla
    No longer living vicariously through other people's pool builds. Pool build is complete on my IG SWCG pool, approx 10,000 gallons. All Jandy equipment - VS 1.5 hp pump, 580 cartridge filter, AquaPure 1400 salt cell, AquaLink PDA system. Dolphin m500. PebbleSheen Blue Surf with shells and beads added. TF-100 w/ SpeedStir. A Houston Pool Build Inside the Loop

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