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Thread: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

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    Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Hey everyone, I have installed an Easytouch8 on my pool/spa.

    I am having a little difficulty in figuring out how to get the system to work properly.

    I have the heater power hooked up to a relay which I have tried attaching to both the SPA slot and to the ELEC HTR slot on the control board... In both cases, the heater gets power and fires up when I go to spa mode... However I cannot turn the heat off unless I turn off spa mode. I want to manually control the Heater rather than have it automatically come on when I go to spa mode.

    Id rather not run a separate 2 wire from the heater as there will be no good way to route it and have it protected. I would prefer that the Easytouch simply power/de-power the heater when it need or no longer needs heat.

    Can I cut the wires for the relay and connect it to the gas heater connector on the board? I think it puts out 24v but I dont know what the on-board relay connections do for all the circuits volt wise.

    Any other Ideas?
    7-10 year old In ground 20,000 gal, Aquabright ecofinish W/ Spa, waterfall and infinity jet, 60 sq foot DE filter, Single speed pump, Racer cleaner

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    I would suggest that you read thru the manual and connect the unit as per their instructions.

    http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/EasyTouchSystemUG.pdf
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    The heater should be wired to the filter pump relay (F) so it can not be on without the pump running.

    Regardless of pool or spa mode, the heater has the ability to run and will be controlled through automation or an external source of you have ScreenLogic.
    -Brian-
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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    What kind of heater are you trying to control? Just to be clear, at this point you are turning the AC power to the heater on/off using the EasyTouch?

    Jim R.
    Finished in 2015 - 17K Gal, IG, 20' x 25' Almost Rectangular Pool, Pebble finish, three rockport water falls. Pentair Equipment: EasyTouch 4, IC40 SWG, 3 HP VS Pump, CCP520 Cartridge Filter.
    TF100 with SpeedStir and SampleSizer, ColorQ Pro 7, Dolphin Premier Robot Cleaner, added Screen Logic 2, added small 3 person Calder Spa.

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    Hey everyone, I have installed an Easytouch8 on my pool/spa.

    I am having a little difficulty in figuring out how to get the system to work properly.

    I have the heater power hooked up to a relay which I have tried attaching to both the SPA slot and to the ELEC HTR slot on the control board... In both cases, the heater gets power and fires up when I go to spa mode... However I cannot turn the heat off unless I turn off spa mode. I want to manually control the Heater rather than have it automatically come on when I go to spa mode.

    Id rather not run a separate 2 wire from the heater as there will be no good way to route it and have it protected. I would prefer that the Easytouch simply power/de-power the heater when it need or no longer needs heat.

    Can I cut the wires for the relay and connect it to the gas heater connector on the board? I think it puts out 24v but I dont know what the on-board relay connections do for all the circuits volt wise.

    Any other Ideas?
    The HEATER connection on the Easy Touch only goes to a set of relay contacts which close when the Easy Touch demands heat. The connection does not provide any voltage.
    38000 Gal, IG, Plaster, 20' x 40' x 10', Attached Raised Spa, Intelliflo VS 3 HP (011018), Pentair Quad DE 60 Filter, Raypak (Rheem) 400,000 BTU (407a low Nox), Easy Touch 8 upgrade, Screenlogic 2 with wireless, IS-4 Spa Side Remote, Stenner 45MPHP10 w/15 gal tank, Intellibrite 5g (3), Dolphin Triton Plus robot with PRO remote, Water Tech Catfish handheld vacuum for spa, TF100 with SpeedStir.

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimrahbe View Post
    What kind of heater are you trying to control? Just to be clear, at this point you are turning the AC power to the heater on/off using the EasyTouch?

    Jim R.
    It is an older raypak heater (about 8 years old I think)

    Yes, right now I have the 220v power being switched on with a relay inside the Easytouch control box... I have the relay plugged into the SPA position which powers the heater on when I am in SPA mode. However doing it this way means I cannot control the heat with the screenlogic interface. It jsut turns the heater on and the heater will warm the water to whatever temp I have set on its panel... this isnt a bad setup, I just dont like the fact that if I somehow switch to spa mode by accident, the heat WILL go on... I want to have to switch to spa AND to manually turn on the heat and a protection. Id hate to accidentally burn up all my propane with one accidental mis-touch on my phone.

    The raypack board manual has a bunch of DO NOT warnings about running a 2 wire connector to a remote controller next to high voltage lines... Which there is NO WAY to avoid. I guess Ill just have to do it if I want it to work properly. Ill do a shielded 2 wire run to the easytouch from the heater and hope it being next to HV lines doesn't matter.

    This is really short sighted on Pentairs part... they could have just let me connect the heater power relay to ANY of the aux ports and then had a setting to allow that relay to close when the heat is needed and allowed and to open it when the desired temp is reached. The heater has its own protections for flow and temp ECT. They made a mountain out of a molehill on this one.
    7-10 year old In ground 20,000 gal, Aquabright ecofinish W/ Spa, waterfall and infinity jet, 60 sq foot DE filter, Single speed pump, Racer cleaner

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    At the Easytouch control panel, hit menu/settings/Man heat. Make sure that the display says "OFF", then back out of the menu.
    Then go back into: Menu/heat/spa. Scroll through and select Heat: OFF, then back out of the menu.
    Now if you go back and hit spa, the heater will not go on until you go back to the heat menu and turn it on. You will need to do this when ever you want to use the spa, and reverse this when you are done using the spa.

    Note: Your heater will need to be hooked up exactly as instructed by the manual for this to work.
    Heater gets the same power as the pump.
    Control wire gets hooked up to the "HEATER" bus (J19)
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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    I have my Raypak 407A connected to a constant 220 V source and the 2 wire remote connection from the heater connected to my Easy Touch. I have the 2 wire cable ty-rapped to the flex watertight plastic conduit that has the heater power wires and have never had a problem with interference. When I want to use the heater, which is not all that often I just use the heater front panel off/on switch to turn the heater on then off when I am done using it. The Heater temp controls are set to max and the Easy Touch cycles the heater according to demand. I do not like to connect any equipment that is microprocessor based to a relay connection. The large voltage spikes generated by the relay contacts opening and closing cannot be good for sensitive electronics. Just my opinion, but as a retired electronics engineer I have seen many electronic systems brought down by large spikes in the power supply voltage.
    38000 Gal, IG, Plaster, 20' x 40' x 10', Attached Raised Spa, Intelliflo VS 3 HP (011018), Pentair Quad DE 60 Filter, Raypak (Rheem) 400,000 BTU (407a low Nox), Easy Touch 8 upgrade, Screenlogic 2 with wireless, IS-4 Spa Side Remote, Stenner 45MPHP10 w/15 gal tank, Intellibrite 5g (3), Dolphin Triton Plus robot with PRO remote, Water Tech Catfish handheld vacuum for spa, TF100 with SpeedStir.

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Thanks Gary.... Ill revisit my install on the heater operation and take that into consideration... makes sense.
    7-10 year old In ground 20,000 gal, Aquabright ecofinish W/ Spa, waterfall and infinity jet, 60 sq foot DE filter, Single speed pump, Racer cleaner

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    The whole idea of a control system is so that you do not have to walk out to the equipment to control things. Just like Pool Clown said, hook the heater into the same power relay as the pump and then use a two wire to connect the heater into the heater pins on the Easytouch and the heaters remote wiring connections. Then you set your pool to either pool or spa and set the temp on the heater to 104. Then put the heater into remote mode. Now the heater is controlled by the Easytouch. When you turn on the spa you then can select the heater option and away you go. No having to go out to the heater to flip the on/off switch to use it. This is the correct way and is shown in the manual.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    I dont think the micro processor gets a voltage spike through the high voltage relay because the relay sends power to the heater's xformer, that steps down voltage (28-32) for the board, high voltage does not go directly to the board.

    The automation switches the heater on and off through a micro relay on the board. It is just a contact, no voltage, however, there is voltage going through that contact from the heater (low voltage).
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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    I keep the power to my heater turned off because I only use it maybe 10 times a year, only in the summer. Why keep supplying power to something that is not used much? Waste of electricity. I also keep my heater covered to keep debris out, so I have to go out to the heater to uncover it anyway and it is not that much trouble to turn the switch on then. Electronic devices are most susceptible to failure when they are powered on, so why subject the heater to that every time the pump is started?
    38000 Gal, IG, Plaster, 20' x 40' x 10', Attached Raised Spa, Intelliflo VS 3 HP (011018), Pentair Quad DE 60 Filter, Raypak (Rheem) 400,000 BTU (407a low Nox), Easy Touch 8 upgrade, Screenlogic 2 with wireless, IS-4 Spa Side Remote, Stenner 45MPHP10 w/15 gal tank, Intellibrite 5g (3), Dolphin Triton Plus robot with PRO remote, Water Tech Catfish handheld vacuum for spa, TF100 with SpeedStir.

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Quote Originally Posted by gary300 View Post
    I have my Raypak 407A connected to a constant 220 V source
    Quote Originally Posted by gary300 View Post
    I keep the power to my heater turned off because I only use it maybe 10 times a year, only in the summer. Why keep supplying power to something that is not used much?
    Hmmm...


    We are just trying to help the OP properly connect his heater to the automation. If you connect the system in any other way than what is recommended, even if it works, you could risk voiding a warranty. Either on the automation or the heater. The manufacture recommends hooking up the power to the same switch as the pump as an extra layer of protection against the heater running without the pump on. For me, it is worth the trickle of electricity spent running the xformer (not necessarily all the electronics) to have extra added safety when the pump is off.

    If you were interested in saving electricity, wouldn't you wire the heater to only have it running (or on stand by) a fraction of the day when the pump is on, rather than 24/7?
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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pool Clown View Post
    Hmmm...


    We are just trying to help the OP properly connect his heater to the automation. If you connect the system in any other way than what is recommended, even if it works, you could risk voiding a warranty. Either on the automation or the heater. The manufacture recommends hooking up the power to the same switch as the pump as an extra layer of protection against the heater running without the pump on. For me, it is worth the trickle of electricity spent running the xformer (not necessarily all the electronics) to have extra added safety when the pump is off.

    If you were interested in saving electricity, wouldn't you wire the heater to only have it running (or on stand by) a fraction of the day when the pump is on, rather than 24/7?
    Thank you everyone for your input... So a little update... I actually had not attempted to heat the spa (ALL THE WAY) with the setup I had now... In reading the manual is said the SPA relay slot was ON anytime spa mode is connected. I assumed that meant that the heat control on the screen logic would have no effect.

    GF and I did a little Tubbin last night and I found out that the screenlogic2 temp does in fact turn the heater off when the desired temp has been reached. So when I go to spa mode, the heater gets power and begins to heat, when the Screen logic temp is reached, the heater power is shut off

    So, as of now the system is set up and working to a degree... I cannot be in spa mode without heat unless I just turn the temperature way down ( the heat off option on screen logic doesn't work, it just goes right back to ON if I try to turn the heat off in spa mode)

    I don't believe I can heat the pool at all with this current setup ( which I don't really NEED to do anyway, very rare that I would want to, but I have done it about once a year so far)

    also, since the power is turned off to the heater when the temp is reached, the pilot goes out.... this means it has to relight the pilot each time it is turned back on... It seems this might wear out the igniters components faster.

    I am still not sure the best way to do this the way I want:

    I don't really want the heater powered anytime the pump is running... but I DO want it powered ONLY if the pump is running.
    I DON'T want the heater to be just powered when the screen logic temp is reached, I DO want to be able to control the heat with screenlogic
    I DONT want the heat automatically coming on in SPA mode I DO want to be able to manually select HEAT ON for spa OR pool

    Still all ears guys, I really appreciate the help.

    On a last note... the included instructions for the Screenlogic talk about setting up Macros on the easytouch... As far as I am able to tell, the method they lay out to do so are outdated or somethign... The (onscreen) buttons they tell me to push to set up the macros do not even exist in the UI... if they did, this would probably be easy.
    7-10 year old In ground 20,000 gal, Aquabright ecofinish W/ Spa, waterfall and infinity jet, 60 sq foot DE filter, Single speed pump, Racer cleaner

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Yes the Easytouch system will monitor and maintain the water temp per the temp you set it to. Just like your home thermostat and heating system. All newer heaters no longer have standing pilot lights but rather a spark ignition just like a BBQ grill. It will not hurt the heater at all to go thru the process to light itself as it is designed to work that way.

    You should be able to turn the heater on/off outside of the spa mode unless its been setup this way for a specific reason. You should also be able to heat the pool on occasion as you want unless of course once again it was setup in a way so you can't. On the Easytouh, check and see if the manual heat option is enabled or not.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    I don't really want the heater powered anytime the pump is running...
    Pull the plug on the heater, and drop it on the floor...

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    but I DO want it powered ONLY if the pump is running.
    Bend over, pick it up, and plug it back in...

    This reminds me of the time when Curly from the 3 stooges is in court and is being sworn in.
    Curly Takes the Stand - YouTube
    At the 0:16 mark.

    I digress...


    That is hair pulling confusing, but it think i know what you mean. If you are set on controlling the power to the heater like that, perhaps it can be done if you have an extra or spare aux (relay). Then power to the heater would be controlled by that relay, and you wouldn't have to make a trip to the equipment each time you want to use the heater, just push that aux's button. AND whatever function you wanted to accomplish.

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    I DON'T want the heater to be just powered when the screen logic temp is reached,
    I'm sure i don't get that one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    I DO want to be able to control the heat with screenlogic
    Screen logic does this out of the box, but if you use the extra relay method as offered above, you would have to turn on that aux (relay) first.

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    I DONT want the heat automatically coming on in SPA mode
    If you use the method above AND as long as the aux is off, the heater will be off. Note: the automation will show that the heater is on, because it is telling it to come on. But there will be no power going to the heater. Does that make sense?

    Quote Originally Posted by Austintatious View Post
    I DO want to be able to manually select HEAT ON for spa OR pool
    That can be done through the automation already either through the screen logic, or the physical remote panel.
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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    I must say what I do with my ET8 is just turn temp down ( with ET8 remote ) while in spa to turn heater off.
    8500 gallon IG Pebble Sheen with Spa. 3hp Pentair VS Intelliflo ( pool ), 3/4 hp WhisperFlo ( water feature ),Pentair Racer, 400K Pentair heater, Pentair 500sqft Cartridge filter, EasyTouch 8, Stenner 45mp2 15gallon wired to ET8

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    Re: Pentair easytouch heater connection option?

    If everything is setup correctly, you should be able to turn the heater off and not just tun the temp down.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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