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Thread: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback welcome

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    60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback welcome

    Hey guys, im currently doing a total remodel of my 60k gallon pool here in Miami, FL.
    Pool is 60ft long by 25ft wide, 7ft deep
    Im working with a contractor, however im pretty much doing all the work. I figured i could do it since i do house remodeling/building/renting anyway for a living and have all the tools needed already and plenty of plumbing/design experience.

    I'm almost done with the plumbing, and i wanted to check in with the forum and see what everyone thought so far.
    Its my first large pool job, so i could use the some feedback.


    SCOPE OF WORK
    all new plumbing and new skimmers - original plumbing done completely wrong
    All skimmers/drains/returns/intakes/deckjets have separate valves/lines for individual control
    3 color lights and new conduit going in
    4 deck jets
    4ft sheet waterfall
    automatic pool leveler
    auto drain plumbing if rain overfills pool like it tends to do here in Miami in the rainy season.
    Pool has multiple cracks in it that have to be fix.
    Large drain system for patio area, since water was ponding next to house
    5 large built in (cbs block/travertine/ledger rock) tree pots will be installed next to pool edge to hold large christmas palms
    5000 sqft noce travertine patio is going in after its all done.
    new waterline tile
    pool will be drained and re-plastered by contractor when the plumbing/tile is done
    new bonding wires


    EQUIPMENT:
    3 X Hayward SP1070 Skimmer
    4 x Pentair Magicstream deck jets
    3 x Pentair 5g color LED lights
    Pentair T40FW autoleveler
    Sheerdecent sheet waterfall
    Existing Large Pentair sand filter - main pool filter system (i might change this out for a large cartridge system)
    Hayward C17502 Star-Clear Plus 175-Square-Foot Cartridge Filter - for water features, oversized to reduce need for cleaning
    Pumps - probably only need 2x 1hp pumps, water features will help circulate the water and reduce demand on main pump?

    ive done all the calculations for flow rates.
    im using 2in pipe for all plumbing for skimmers, water feature intakes (2 intakes spaced 10ft apart), and the 5 returns
    30psi leak tests passed so far


    ISSUES
    1. multiple cracks in pool and pool has leaks. will require staples and hydraulic cement to fix...any tips on this?
    2. how to fix cracks by waterline tile? just grind out, epoxy, hydraulic cement, or also more rebar/staples?


    PHOTOBUCKET LINK HERE WITH ALL PICS
    Omegahouse Slideshow by betahousepics | Photobucket

    Thanks for any feedback!
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    more photos....i cant figure out how to add more pics...keep saying im over the kb limit!!

    more here - pics of crack issues

    Omegahouse Slideshow by betahousepics | Photobucket
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    ComputerGuyInNOLA's Avatar
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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    Wow, nice work! About the only plumbing I can do is hook up a water hose. That pool is ginormous. I cant wait to see this when finished. Keep the pics coming and good luck.
    Gunite/Plaster pool at 13k gallons. All Jandy with CL340 series cartridge filter, 1.5 HP Jandy Stealth pump. Jandy 1400 SWCG and PDA4 controller. Dual waterfalls. Polaris 280. Pool installed August 2012. Southern Louisiana. And lets not forget my trusty TF100 test kit!

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    ellsian's Avatar
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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    Huge pool! Best of luck in your remodel You'll need a photobucket account or other outside hosting to add more pics. Photo and image hosting, free photo galleries, photo editing I think if you pay to become a premium member of this website they also give you more pic room.
    Swim ready :) My Pool Build Thread. IG shotcrete 34x16 Grecian shape. 22k gallons. 3'6 - 8'6 deep. 12x5 Baja ledge w/ 2 Bubblers, 14' raised beam sheer descent waterfall in stacked rock. Custom stone diving board. Hayward sand filter, VS pump, Aquarite T-15 SWCG. A&A In floor system w/ Gamma 4 venturi heads, Blue surf Pebble sheen, Colorlogic LED. Future Travertine Sandcastle Owner.

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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    Wow thats a project.

    On Cracks this thread is very good: DIY Pool restoration project

    On smaller cracks many PB just insert epoxy.

    The values you are using are generally considered 5 year values at best, although you have them in a semi protected areas.

    I realize water is almost free in Florida but the sand filter you are installing is undersized for the pool. On TFP we recommend Over sizing your filter. Generally by a factor of 2. Right now you are set for weekly back washing. If we are sticking with Hayward you need a 36" filter.

    Generally you can get a better warranty if you purchase a pump and two accessories from the same dealer.

    You need to think about pool automation.
    22k gallon IG pebblefina, Jandy 1.5 HP VS, Jandy CV Cartridge filter, Fafco solar panels, Polaris 360 supply side cleaner, waterfall

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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    Quote Originally Posted by gwegan View Post
    Wow thats a project.

    The values you are using are generally considered 5 year values at best, although you have them in a semi protected areas.
    valves? i should be ok, its surrounded by house/walls, and doesnt get sunlight. PVC valves still only last so long I realize. i gave plenty of room in the piping to allow for replumbing of valves in the future as needed. Ill probably go with the union type removable valves next time.



    Quote Originally Posted by gwegan View Post
    Wow thats a project.

    I realize water is almost free in Florida but the sand filter you are installing is undersized for the pool. On TFP we recommend Over sizing your filter. Generally by a factor of 2. Right now you are set for weekly back washing. If we are sticking with Hayward you need a 36" filter.
    I have 2 filters. a very large Pentair sand filter. im not sure exactly the exact size, but posted a pic of it on the photobucket link. its around 28-29in wide. top multi-valve is rated for 125gpm. it was the only filter on the pool for a long time and it worked fine.

    now im adding a second cartridge filter for the water features, 175 sqft

    sand filter should easily flow 75gpm, and the water features need 100gpm, so im at 175 gpm.

    60000 /175/60 = 5.7hrs = 1 water change out every 5 to 6 hours

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    Crack repair before replaster - How to repair different type of cracks? - see pics

    Im doing a remodel of my large 60k gallon pool
    i have 8 cracks that i can see as of now.

    1 large one
    1 horizontal at top of pool
    6 vertical small/hairline cracks


    Link to photos here:
    Cracks Slideshow by betahousepics | Photobucket


    From doing a lot of research

    Large crack
    1. grind out area to v-shape, wash, dry
    2. silicone caulk bead?
    3. epoxy
    4. install staples (torque lock type?)
    5. foam injection needed?
    6. Hydraulic cement
    7. Plaster over as part of the diamondbrite installation


    Small cracks/hairline cracks
    1. grind out area to v-shape, wash, dry
    2. silicone caulk bead
    3. epoxy
    4. Hydraulic cement?
    5. Plaster over as part of the diamondbrite installation


    Im considering caulk in the crack because the ground might shift again and even if it shifts and recracks the silicone will still hold a seal


    thanks for the feedback.

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    Re: Crack repair before replaster - How to repair different type of cracks? - see pic

    The plaster finish will Crack if there is further ground movement, caulk would make no difference. Epoxy injection would be advised on the cracks, torque lock wouldn't hurt but very expensive. The large crack in the beam where tile was should probably be chipped out, steel tied in and redone.


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    Re: Crack repair before replaster - How to repair different type of cracks? - see pic

    You need to keep everything in one thread. A Mod should come along and combine this to one thread. Mod note: done!
    Yesterday I posted one of the best threads on here about crack repair. You should read that a couple of times.

    There are a lot of different ways to repair cracks. Different quality epoxies and different grouts are used in different parts of the country. You have the concept correct. Some builders use staples some do not.

    Do you have large voids you need to fill with foam?

    Silicone caulk will most likely only prevent proper adhesion of the concrete, grout or plaster.

    Looking at your pool I have serious doubts about this. It appears that the pool is old and may not have any rebar. To me that suggests that this will most likely crack again at or near the original cracks. It appears you have normal expansion cracks and no underlying structure to prevent them. So while you can repair the cracks I suspect this will just reoccur.
    22k gallon IG pebblefina, Jandy 1.5 HP VS, Jandy CV Cartridge filter, Fafco solar panels, Polaris 360 supply side cleaner, waterfall

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    Re: Crack repair before replaster - How to repair different type of cracks? - see pic

    Gwegan,

    thanks, i saw your link and read through it yesterday.

    im checking the plans now.
    the pool is a 1980. the plans are on file with the city. it was done with permits. plans show

    "steel reinforcement
    walls: 5 @ 12 oc both ways
    floor: 5 @ 9 oc bottom
    5 @ 12 oc temp

    poured concrete:
    walls 6 to 8in

    gunite:
    walls: 4" top to 6" bott"

    I cant tell if it says 3 or 5 on the rebar, looks like 5. the prints are poor. i see #3 and #5 rebar in the area around the deck next to the pool that i had to dig up.

    i had some sinking of the ground around the pool due to poor drainage, and i think that is the source of the problem. im going to be fixing the drainage issue as well.

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    Re: Crack repair before replaster - How to repair different type of cracks? - see pic

    Wow it doesn't look like rebar in there. But never can tell. So why did it crack? Can you tell? CAn you make some changes that won't let that happen again.

    Frankly if it has rebar it is a better bet.

    I would call three pool repair guys in your area -- ask them what they would do and how they would do it. Get a price from each. If one makes sense then hire him after beating him up on the price of course. But if you think they are all too high then use what you have learned from them about how the locals do it and do it your self.

    This isn't easy nor fast. And there is no guaranteed result.
    22k gallon IG pebblefina, Jandy 1.5 HP VS, Jandy CV Cartridge filter, Fafco solar panels, Polaris 360 supply side cleaner, waterfall

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    Household6's Avatar
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    60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback welcome

    May want to take a look at my thread on our revamp.
    It's not perfect, but we saved thousands! (May even decide to do your own resurface.) good luck!

    It's Pool Repair Weekend!
    It's Pool Repair Weekend!


    20x40 in-ground concrete "vintage" pool
    Approx 38k gal
    Concrete, plaster and epoxy paint
    Sand filter
    DIY plaster resurface repairs completed 6/2015.
    20x40 in-ground concrete "vintage" pool
    Approx 35k gal
    Concrete, plaster and epoxy paint
    Sand filter
    DIY plaster resurface repairs completed 6/2015.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    Here is another epic DIY thread
    DIY Pool restoration project
    TFP Moderator
    If TFP helped you or saved you money - Become a TFP Supporter! <--Click here
    2012 build and pics, 20k gal gunite, black onyx pebblesheen, OK flagstone, IntellifoVS, cart filter w/Pleatco, IC40 SWG, Solartouch, 5 12'x4' solar panels, HP50HA heat pump, 8mil solar cover, borates, TF-100 test kit, SONOS, Doheny's Discovery Robot, hot tub on bleach

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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    UPDATE

    the backside of the crack isnt wide, more of a hairline
    the front side looked wide because it had been V-cut and epoxy filled before, and the fix failed

    backside
    20160407_162609_zpscrcgxagj.jpg Photo by betahousepics | Photobucket
    20160405_193548_zpsupnku534.jpg Photo by betahousepics | Photobucket

    front side
    20160406_144711_zpsa9eboxz0.jpg Photo by betahousepics | Photobucket


    Im going to try to use my own homemade staples from #5 rebar
    pic here
    http://i1349.photobucket.com/albums/...ps6wyzpvnq.jpg


    So large #5 rebar staples, holes drilled a bit too wide, hammer them in
    concrete epoxy to secure staple
    epoxy ejection
    hydraulic cement over it all

    thoughts?

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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    Thanks for the pictures of the skimmer, I'm thinking about redoing mine and that is exactly what I had in mind. Unfortunately, I had a crack that wend down the side of the skimmer, was fixed with steel staples, and then after a couple months reappeared. I think I need to to reinforcement over the top and back of the skimmer as you did. I would use your rebar staples on the back side of the wall, since you have it exposed- then I would alternate on the water side with either rebar or purchased staples. I'm curious if there is a significant difference in flexibility of rebar vs steel plate staples.

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    Re: 60k gallon pool total remodel/makeover Owner/builder - details/pics, feedback wel

    I got out my Zircon Electronic Metal Locator for finding rebar, and I have rebar everywhere in the pool shell.

    I started grinding out the cracks. they are all hairline cracks, and disappear completely after 1/2 to 1 inch in
    The large crack had been previously repaired with epoxy or similar, and thats why it looked big. It is a fingernail size crack once i started grinding.

    So plan will be
    1. Grind out cracks
    2. Wash with water/dry
    3. Vulkem 116 Polyurethane Sealant - Good for long term underwater use, boats, etc. Also used successfully on pool cracks as a standalone repair at the surface as per other users
    4. Concrete Epoxy
    5. custom made staples out of #5 rebar
    6. Hydraulic cement
    7. grind flat, ready for plaster

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