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Thread: I fixed it till it's broke

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    I fixed it till it's broke

    So, I've had this pool for a couple years now and never had much issue with the water. I've never tested my chemistry of my water before, until the other day I got a free test kit. I thought it would be interesting to experiment with. It tests FC, pH, and bromine.

    The initial test revealed I had plenty of FC, somewhere between 2 and 3ppm. But the pH was a pale yellow reading below 6.8. So I went and got some pH up from the grocery store. (It was late and the pool supply was closed) I added a little and it turned dark green as mixed with the water. I didn't think much about it, because bromine does that too, but clears up quickly. This didn't and the pH didn't rise at all. So I added more and more. The pH never rose and I ended up with greenish water and some weird dust on the bottom.

    Today, I took a water sample to the pool supply and he said the pH was VERY low. He gave me a bucket of soda ash, saying to add a few pounds at time, in increments of 4hrs, while keeping the pump running on low speed. Now my water is dark olive green. Not opaque or clowdy. Just Army green. I called him and told him about it and he said to just give it some time and get back to him. But in the mean time, does anyone know what I'm talking about?
    I tested my tap water that I use to fill it. It checked out at 7.6

    The pool as of now
    FC 3.0ppm
    pH is below range. If I had to guess I would say around 6.t
    Attached Images Attached Images
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Chuck, welcome to TFP. I'm afraid you're not going to hear the same things here as you did from the pool store, mainly because we have learned the pool store testing and advise is typically incorrect. Your FC is not fine, it's probably low, quite low in-fact based on your CYA level which is allowing algae to bloom. Before we get too far ahead, you have to decide if you want to take charge of your pool on your own, or rely on the pool store. If you want to do this on your own, you must have the right test kit. Please see the TF-100 link in my sig. Also, don't waste your money on those pool store products. Most are a waste of $$$.

    From there you must go back to water basics with the Pool School - ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry. You'll also need the following pages to help as well:
    Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart
    Poolmath calculator
    Pool School - Recommended Levels
    Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals
    TFTestkits.net

    Start at the ABCs of Water Chemistry, then also read the "SLAM" link in my sig as that is what will be required to change your water from green to clear. Give those things a review first, then let us know if you have questions. We'll be glad to help.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    This is not algae. This is a reaction that happened almost instantly (within minutes) of adding soda ash. My pool was sparkling clear before I did this.
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Perhaps you're correct. But we'll need a full set of test results from either a TF-100 or Taylor K-2006 test kit to know what we're up against. Are you able to post these for us:
    FC
    CC
    CYA
    pH
    TA
    CH

    It's possible something you added reacted with the water, but we need to know your current stats. This will drive what advise we can provide.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    FC 8
    CC 8
    CYA 130
    pH 7.0
    TA 70
    CH 600
    Also:
    Base 20
    Iron 0
    Copper 0
    Total dissolved solids 600
    Phosphates 100
    I had to go back to the pool store they didn't carry the test kit you mentioned so this data is from the pool store. Yes I know it can be inaccurate but that's all I've got for now. I'll order the test kit soon. Can anything be said about this test data? The guy saw my water and said to just give it s few days and continue the soda ash treatment.
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Your problem is most likely metals in your water, when the pH changed they precipitated out of solution, by chance are you on well water or have you added any pool chemicals containing copper (most of the cheaper algaecides)?

    Ike

    p.s. note that 0 iron 0 copper on the pool store testing, yet another reason we don't trust their test results
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
    I use and endorse TFtestKits TF-100 from http://tftestkits.net
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    I have used some algicide before. Only a handful of times. I'm on city water.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Does the tf100 year for metal? Idk if they actually ran the test
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    If I understand your post, the pool store does not use TFTest kit. It's something you buy and use yourself. Pool store testing is historically very inaccurate.

    TFTestkits.net

    We purchase our own and test our own pool water.

    Apologies if I misunderstood.
    32K gallon Plaster - 1hp Hayward 2 speed Super Pump - Hayward S200 Sand Filter - TF100XL
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    No, I understand what the tf100 Is. I just don't know all of ours capabilities or what it tests. I was asking if it tested for metals. And I know the pool store doesn't use the tf100 they have their own proprietary testing stuff. I'm not sure if they actually tested my water for metal . that might be why the reading is zero. Thanks for your help btw
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    No the TF-100 does not test for metals because it is a test most people don't need and the metals test are rather expensive, also it does not tend to tell you much new information as either your fill water has metals in it, or they were added to your pool some way. If they were added then the best bet it to drain and refill, if they are in your fill water you will need to use a metal sequesterant, the problem is the sequesterant breaks down over time, so you have to keep adding more. If you are on municipal water you can likely download a water test analysis or get a printed one from your water department which may include test for iron and copper.

    Ike
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
    I use and endorse TFtestKits TF-100 from http://tftestkits.net
    ~Remember TFP counts on your donations to keep this site ad free~

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Gotcha, sorry. No it doesn't, for the most part most of us don't "care" about metals as we don't add anything that has metals in it. If one has metals I assume the only options are water replacement or sequestrant (sp?) High points are FC/CYA and pH, the rest is fine tuning (usually).
    32K gallon Plaster - 1hp Hayward 2 speed Super Pump - Hayward S200 Sand Filter - TF100XL
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    I ran some water from my faucet into a glass. I added some soda ash and the water didn't turn green. The pH checked out at 7.6 (before I added soda ash) so the question is, why had the pH in the pool dropped so drastically? Could the copper and cast iron components of my pool heater be the source of the metal? The pool pump has a plastic wet end. The hardware is stainless steel.
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Again and I can't stress enough, I know the pool store is inaccurate. For more that's all I have to go on until I get a better test kit. That being said, are there any problems with the numbers from above? The report that they printed out for me states that my CH and CYA are high and my TA and pH are low.
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Now I've noticed a few bits of PVC cement from the pipes floating around. It's not a lot, jus a few flakes. Also there seems to be a thin layer of an oily substance and there's Bubbles that persist on the surface like someone is spitting in it.

    Idk, maybe I should just drain it and start over. I'm going to have nightmares about this until it gets resolved.
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    The numbers above show CC is 8. That number doesn't seem like it could be right at all. CYA is high and that is the test pool stores are notoriously wrong on. How do you chlorinate your pool? If you are using trichlor or dichlor, that is adding CYA.
    18*36*23 true "L" vinyl IG 29,000 gallons. SWG. TF-100 test kit.
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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    They may not have tested for metal previously. Take a sample to the pool store and ask them to test for iron and copper.

    Here is an article from Pool School about metals, Pool School - Metals in the Water and Metal Stains
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    Tricloro tablets in a floater. And I looked at the paper is TAC that's at 8 (total available chlorine). My own test of chlorine and bromine reads at 3 for chlorine and 4.4 for bromine
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    And what is bromine btw? I don't see it in the chemistry ABCs
    15 foot round pool that I partially buried 24 inches. Vinyl liner. About 5000 gallons. Two HP two speed pump. Set on a timer to run for eight hrs a night. Water way filter housing. Laars ld250 propane heater.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    There are only two things that turn a pool green algae or metals. If you want to believe the Pool Store test then with CYA at 130 you will need to drain about half the water to reduce the CYA to a manageable level. That will also help dilute the metal in the water that most likely was added with algaecide.

    Our recommendation is to order a good test kit, Pool School - Test Kits Compared. I use the TF100 from TFTestkits.net. They ship from NC so you will most likely have it by Wedenesday if you order now. Or you can get a Taylor K-2006C. The C is important. Don't get the plain K-2006, there aren't enough tests in that kit. Once you get the test kit we can help you a lot more.

    For now all I would do is order a test kit and take a water sample to the pool store and ask them to test for iron and copper.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck2385 View Post
    And what is bromine btw? I don't see it in the chemistry ABCs
    There is most likely no bromine in your pool. Unless you put it in there. It is an alternative sanitizer to chlorine that some people use in hot tubs.
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    Re: I fixed it till it's broke

    The same test measures either Chlorine or Bromine, not AND, if you have never added Bromine to your pool then you don't have any. Few people use Bromine in swimming pools, however it is fairly popular with hot tubs, unlike chlorine bromine will not off gas so it stays in the water forever. As to your other questions, it is possible that over time the trichlor lowered your pH (trichlor is very acidic), and that corroded your heater and your heater guts was the source for the metals, I had that happen to a pool heater many years ago, and one day the pool turned st patricks day green.
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
    I use and endorse TFtestKits TF-100 from http://tftestkits.net
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