Moving pool electrical lines

[sarabooo]

I need to move these to the back wall of the shed. How would you go about it?. Also, does the power from the home go into the thermodyne(black cap) first then down and back up out those two pvc lines?.The shorter pvc line goes down to the pool light and the taller is the 220 for the pump which is on the slab to the left..

 

[jblizzle]

Are you trying to move all of that? Why?
I think we will need to better understand what it is you are trying to accomplish.

I am not sure you are supposed to move the black box which is the junction for the pool light, the wiring or which depends on your setup. That black "deck box" I think has some building codes related to its location.

 

[sarabooo]

Yep I am. I want to move the outdoor panel to the wall about 2 ft back and get all that out of the walk/ work area. The pool light junction can be moved to the right 2 feet and kept at the same distance, almost, from the pool and same height off the ground which is where they get picky I believe. Or I can eliminate the pool light wiring altogether which would make the job much easier. Everyone here is afraid to turn a light on in a pool anyway and will not and has not used it in many years. I know they are safe.Larger taller feed to the pump is easy the pool light not so much.But doable.

 

[gwegan]

Ok So we all agree the black plastic box is a pool light junction box. For each light in the pool there will be a cord running from the rear of the light fixture in the pool through its own dedicated conduit directly to this junction box. So in the picture that conduit from your light is still connected to the junction box. Or it should be.

It appears that at one time there was a subpanel above the two un-capped conduit coming out of the ground. The conduit from the junction box to the missing sub panel is also missing.

Yes you can move the junction box. But you have to be careful not to cut or harm the pool light cord. It cannot be spliced. If you have never moved a subpanel you should educate yourself on that little endeavor also. Subpanels can be confusing to weekend electricians. Note that the subpanel must be 5 feet from the pool and if is serving as the maintenance disconnect for the pump, must generally be within line of sight to the pump and have no more than six breakers.

Because pool electrical is different the link below gets you an illustrated guide to pool electrical. The part you want starts on page 13.

http://www.mikeholt.com/download.php?file=PDF/Swimming_Pools_and_Spas_2014NEC.pdf

After reading the section above and reading up or watching some youtube videos you think its too much of a challenge then hire an electrician.

 

[sarabooo]

You pretty much nailed it. I removed the subpanel . "The conduit from the junction box to the missing sub panel is also missing". I have only one light and the other side junction box to subpanel conduit is blocked from view with the 1in pvc on the board.I ordered one of these with the wall mount bracket to attach to the wall.

 

[jblizzle]

Well, the lights are safe if they are wired correctly and are on a GFCI circuit

Since you have to splice wires together, the only ways I can think of doing it are above ground, which may not be what you are looking for.

 

[sarabooo]

Yes sir, all splicing will be done above ground in proper boxes. They had it wired breaker panel to gfci outlet to on/off switch to light junction box to light.So the gfci protection was acquired from the gfci outlet as it was downstream. There were no gfci breakers anywhere feeding the pump.The pool equipment is fed from the main panel in the garage straight underground to the pool house. So I will install one in the garage panel as well as a surge protector for the new vs pump.

 

[gwegan]

Ok that Junction box will work.

If you carefully no very carefully excavate your pool light lines and cut the conduit and NOT CUTTING OR HARMING THE CORD re route the conduit. That means you assemble the conduit and place it over the existing cord. This can be very frustrating. You then run conduit to your new sub-panel and from the new sub-panel to the main panel.

Buying new lights works too.

 

[tim5055]

The only issue I see is that as gwegan pointed out, the lamp cord from the light niche to the connection box can not have any splices. If the wire were to be too short to remain within code you would have to purchase a new light with a longer cord as it is sealed at the light end of the cord.

 

[sarabooo]

Well I successfully cut the pvc without nicking the wires with a 2in tubing cutter. The minute I cut the pvc to the pool light water is streaming out of the conduit.And still a slow trickle coming out. I bet that is not good being electric wires in there and all. Leaking through the pool light gasket and coming thru the electric conduit pressurized by the water in the pool. That's really neat huh?. If I shove an elbow and a two foot straight piece pointing up I can stop the flow.If I could find a pcv cement that will work when wet I can repair this until I drain the pool and replace the light?. If not drain the freaking pool and wait till things dry out so I can glue this elbow..This is like owning a boat.

- - - Updated - - -

Thi is supposed to work wet
Oatey Rain-R-Shine 8 oz. PVC Cement-308913 - The Home Depot

 

[jblizzle]

It is fairly normal for the conduit from the light to be full of water, that is why the deck box is supposed to be a certain height above water level.

 

[sarabooo]

That is interesting but it seems proper gasketing at the underwater light would prevent this from happening. Just seems improper to me.

 

[jblizzle]

Water is supposed to be in the light niche to aide in cooling the back of the light. Some people try to seal where the cord enters the conduit, but that just makes it harder to remove the cable if you need to replace the light. I think there are some rubber gaskets though that can be used around the cable.

 

[gwegan]

This is why pool electrical is weird. I should have warned you. My bad.

The NEC assumes that this conduit will be wet inside. That is why the wires are in a cord and sealed to the back of the light fixture and why the junction box must be a specified height above the ground and the pool water.

 

[sarabooo]

Well I have to try to seal of the conduit with something long enough to glue on my elbows to move it. Any good ideas on what to put in there?. Plumbers putty? Shouldn't cause a problem I would think.

 

[thepoolman]

Don't put anything in there that will interfere with pulling a new cord through there if you have to replace the cord in the future. I say glue with "blue glue," the hot stuff. Gob it up real good on the new, dry conduit and stick it on there quickly. Could also try something like a paper towel that will plug it just long enough to do the job, but will disenegrate over time.

 

[pooldv]

The blue pvc cement is supposed to work when wet.
PVC Rain-R-Shine® Blue Cement | Plastic Pipe Cements & Primers | Oatey

 

[gwegan]

Pool is correct the blue stuff works when wet

 

[sarabooo]

I'm going to stuff the pvc line with bread tomorrow morning and glue it with the blue glue and see what happens. If not I will get one of these" LIGHT CORD STOPPER: For the most permanent solution to a pool light conduit leak, seal up the hole in the light niche with a Light Cord Stopper. Made in two sizes, to fit 3/4" or 1" hole, with a hole running through it to allow the light cord to pass through. Just push it in place firmly to keep water from entering the conduit. Good for new pools, too - to prevent a light conduit leak in the first place!"
I'll just install it on my cut end. No more replacing pool light after that.

 

[danpik]

The bread will not work as the water pressure will be too high. It will be best to pull the light and plug the conduit from the pool side with a stopper as you mentioned. I will add this bit of caution when working with electrical wiring and PVC cement. Most wire covering can be damaged by PVC cement. It may not show up right away. I would pull the wire out of the conduit and pull a string in behind it before I glued up the conduit. Years ago I worked on a problem at a house that had an underground service that was acting up. Lots of voltage loss between the pole (meter location) and the house service panel. The service finally lost one leg of the service. Suspecting a compromised conductor in the underground pipe, we pulled the 4 conductors out. As we pulled them out we noted that every 10' along the conductors the insulation was eaten away and in some instances was gone clear down to the aluminum wire. (wish I had pictures) as we kept pulling (200' of wire) we finally found the problem. One of the hot leads had corroded completely thru and broke. We had to pull the other segment of wire from the other end of the conduit. After talking with the owner we discovered that he did the install and hired an electrician to do the connections. His method of installing this was to slip each segment of conduit over the wires and glue them up as he went along. When he did this the glue would drip onto the wire and started the damage to the insulation.