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Thread: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

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    Matchless1's Avatar
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    Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    I was hoping someone could help me with a little issue I'm having regarding the selection coping. To make a long story not as long, I am considering using a 2" x 10" x 24" quartzite coping. The bond beam will be 12" and the coping will overhang on the pool side by about 1". So this leaves 3" of bond beam not covered by the coping. We will have concrete decking up to the coping. So, my concern is the 3" of bond beam not covered by the coping. Is it ok to pour the concrete decking over this portion? The concrete would only be about 2" thick (due to the 2" thick coping) in the 3" leading up to the coping above the bond beam. Is there a recommended method for doing this to minimize the chance of cracking the deck in this 2" x 3" cross sectional area?

    I have to think this is done all the time, especially with brick coping. My builder is confident there will not be any issues, but hasn't had a chance to really explain it to me yet.
    14K gal, IG Shotcrete, Depth: 3'6" to 5'6", Pentair Intellipro XF VS Pumps (2), CCP520 Filter, Intellitouch i9+3S w/ ScreenLogic2, DEL Ozone EC-20 w/ Stenner Pump for Chlorine, Flagstone Coping, Moss/Creek Rock Waterfall, Dolphin 15.5' Slide, Intellibrite 5G Pool Lights (3), Globrites (2), Kichler Underwater Waterfall Lights (4), Paramount Paralevel Auto Leveler, 4'x8'Techno-Solis Solar Panels (14), Dolphin S300i Cleaner, My Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    The back side of the bond beam can be chipped out the depth of the poured concrete deck. This is a fairly typical practice when the coping isn't as wide as the bond beam and will pose no issues.
    -Brian-
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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    You should 45 the beam/chip it back, then add your foam or some type of expansion joint to separate the deck from coping and beam.

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Quote Originally Posted by bdavis466 View Post
    The back side of the bond beam can be chipped out the depth of the poured concrete deck. This is a fairly typical practice when the coping isn't as wide as the bond beam and will pose no issues.
    They did this exact thing to my pool today.
    Gunite Pool/Spa, CLI Caribbean blue crystal stone smooth, Pentair 3hp Intellifo VS, Pentair Quad DE Filter, Pentair 400k BTU Heater, KK Prowler 820, Pentair PSL4 controler with Screenlogic wifi, Inline Chlorinator, Pentair 1.5hp Spa Blower, TF-100 Test Kit w/ Speed Stir. My 2016 Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Quote Originally Posted by bradj View Post
    They did this exact thing to my pool today.
    Did they saw cut it or just hand chisel out a few inches all the way around? How deep did they go? Seems like a lot of work either way.
    14K gal, IG Shotcrete, Depth: 3'6" to 5'6", Pentair Intellipro XF VS Pumps (2), CCP520 Filter, Intellitouch i9+3S w/ ScreenLogic2, DEL Ozone EC-20 w/ Stenner Pump for Chlorine, Flagstone Coping, Moss/Creek Rock Waterfall, Dolphin 15.5' Slide, Intellibrite 5G Pool Lights (3), Globrites (2), Kichler Underwater Waterfall Lights (4), Paramount Paralevel Auto Leveler, 4'x8'Techno-Solis Solar Panels (14), Dolphin S300i Cleaner, My Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    They used a saw, cut down even to the compacted road base. The concrete pour up to the coping/bond will be the same depth as the rest of the decking.
    Gunite Pool/Spa, CLI Caribbean blue crystal stone smooth, Pentair 3hp Intellifo VS, Pentair Quad DE Filter, Pentair 400k BTU Heater, KK Prowler 820, Pentair PSL4 controler with Screenlogic wifi, Inline Chlorinator, Pentair 1.5hp Spa Blower, TF-100 Test Kit w/ Speed Stir. My 2016 Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    I think I understand. Got any pictures of the before/after/during? How long did it take to do? About how much width and depth did they have to remove?


    14K gal, IG Shotcrete, Depth: 3'6" to 5'6", Pentair Intellipro XF VS Pumps (2), CCP520 Filter, Intellitouch i9+3S w/ ScreenLogic2, DEL Ozone EC-20 w/ Stenner Pump for Chlorine, Flagstone Coping, Moss/Creek Rock Waterfall, Dolphin 15.5' Slide, Intellibrite 5G Pool Lights (3), Globrites (2), Kichler Underwater Waterfall Lights (4), Paramount Paralevel Auto Leveler, 4'x8'Techno-Solis Solar Panels (14), Dolphin S300i Cleaner, My Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    I don't have an after picture.. but you can see in this before picture there was about ~1" of the bond above the compacted road base.

    The after is a smooth edge from the back of the coping straight down to the compacted road base.

    Gunite Pool/Spa, CLI Caribbean blue crystal stone smooth, Pentair 3hp Intellifo VS, Pentair Quad DE Filter, Pentair 400k BTU Heater, KK Prowler 820, Pentair PSL4 controler with Screenlogic wifi, Inline Chlorinator, Pentair 1.5hp Spa Blower, TF-100 Test Kit w/ Speed Stir. My 2016 Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Has the pool's unite been shot yet? If not, let the crew know your intentions with the coping and they will notch it for you when its still workable.
    -Brian-
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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    They chipped on the back of my bond beam too, but the patio took care of it. However on one part we don't have patio, but I'm hoping to bring up river rock to cover that bond beam.

    Also, you might consider MSI's 2x12x24 quartzite coping as I think the additional 2" will look better. Mine shipped out of California- was about $11/sq ft plus shipping. I also did the 6x6 quartzite tile from them. It was really cheap - $4/sq ft.
    Construction underway.

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Quote Originally Posted by bdavis466 View Post
    Has the pool's unite been shot yet? If not, let the crew know your intentions with the coping and they will notch it for you when its still workable.
    No. We haven't even dug yet, so I'll do what you recommend. Thanks!

    Quote Originally Posted by And5555 View Post
    They chipped on the back of my bond beam too, but the patio took care of it. However on one part we don't have patio, but I'm hoping to bring up river rock to cover that bond beam.

    Also, you might consider MSI's 2x12x24 quartzite coping as I think the additional 2" will look better. Mine shipped out of California- was about $11/sq ft plus shipping. I also did the 6x6 quartzite tile from them. It was really cheap - $4/sq ft.
    Well, since you asked...finding the quartzite coping I want has been a real challenge to say the least! Basically, I want the 2x12x24 in a "Golden White" (MSI) or "Mountain Peak" (East/West) color, but with one edge chiseled. Our local supplier is quoting me 8 weeks for the Golden White, but only in a bull nose edge. Chiseling would have to be done by the builder (extra expense). The Mountain Peak is not made in "pool coping". The closest thing they have are "wall caps", which have both edges chiseled. This means that about 2" will need to be cut off in order to use it as coping. The Mountain Peak stone is also a lot more expensive ($37 per 2x12x24 piece), BUT delivery would be 2-3 weeks, which works with my schedule. 8 weeks does not (thanks China!). So, that's where the 10" deep coping comes from. It's basically my only option besides waiting an extra 5 weeks or getting the 2x16x24 Mountain Peak pieces, which I just can't swallow at $50 a piece!
    14K gal, IG Shotcrete, Depth: 3'6" to 5'6", Pentair Intellipro XF VS Pumps (2), CCP520 Filter, Intellitouch i9+3S w/ ScreenLogic2, DEL Ozone EC-20 w/ Stenner Pump for Chlorine, Flagstone Coping, Moss/Creek Rock Waterfall, Dolphin 15.5' Slide, Intellibrite 5G Pool Lights (3), Globrites (2), Kichler Underwater Waterfall Lights (4), Paramount Paralevel Auto Leveler, 4'x8'Techno-Solis Solar Panels (14), Dolphin S300i Cleaner, My Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Gotcha. I did the bullnose golden white. I'm guessing this is what you're thinking: Pool Copings - Caps - Treads - Golden White Caps Quartzite- Landscape


    You might just call the guy at tilesbay.com and see what his timeline looks like. I kept getting quoted various dates but it ended up being a lot quicker. You can also call an MSI rep at your closest distribution center (mine was Houston) - just say you're a builder.
    Construction underway.

    33x23 freeform 16k gallon IG pool, pebblesheen, SWG in Austin, TX
    Pentair 3HP VS pump, Hayward 30" sand filter
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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Yes, that's basically what I would need, since they don't make the coping with the chiseled edge. This would still leave me at 10" for the coping after I lop off the other chiseled edge. And I don't see that they offer a 16" size, which I'll need for some steps, so that's not good. Might be able to make the 12" work though. I'll try calling those people you mentioned.


    14K gal, IG Shotcrete, Depth: 3'6" to 5'6", Pentair Intellipro XF VS Pumps (2), CCP520 Filter, Intellitouch i9+3S w/ ScreenLogic2, DEL Ozone EC-20 w/ Stenner Pump for Chlorine, Flagstone Coping, Moss/Creek Rock Waterfall, Dolphin 15.5' Slide, Intellibrite 5G Pool Lights (3), Globrites (2), Kichler Underwater Waterfall Lights (4), Paramount Paralevel Auto Leveler, 4'x8'Techno-Solis Solar Panels (14), Dolphin S300i Cleaner, My Pool Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Alternatively, MSI makes a 16 x 24 coping with bullnose edge. I wonder if your masonry guy could make the chiseled edge. My guy made a bullnose edge in one part it looks good.
    Construction underway.

    33x23 freeform 16k gallon IG pool, pebblesheen, SWG in Austin, TX
    Pentair 3HP VS pump, Hayward 30" sand filter
    Build thread: New Austin, TX Owner Build

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    I need advice on this topic...specifically if it's necessary to cut down the bond beam in order to keep a consistent concrete thickness up to the coping. I had a patio guy out today who says he does 50% of the pools for the largest pool builder in Austin and also listed off several other reputable pool builders. I really like this guy, except he said that he does not cut down the bond beam. He said he does not want to mess with the integrity of the pool and has never had an issue. He is a reputable tier1 contractor.
    Build thread - 15'x30' rectangular gunite pool; 17,400 gal; 5'x8' spa raised 12" w/ 8' spillover; 10'x6' Baja shelf; Two 18" tall columns w/ 27" water bowls; Light travertine coping w/ Light 2x4' split travertine ledgestone; Jules Rustic Blue tile; Pentair IC60 SWG; Pentair IntelliFlo 2 VST; Pentair SuperFlo 1HP; Pentair CC520 Cartridge filter; Pentair Easy Touch 8 w/ ScreenLogic2; Four Pentair GloBrite; Raypak 406 heater.

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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    He is correct, don't cut the bond beam. Leaving a couple of inches for the deck to overlap the bond beam is common practice. There are pics of minel in the link in my sig.
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    Re: Coping Shorter Than Bond Beam

    Thanks. There seem to be different methods...some patio guys say use deck dowels (rebar) to tie the patio and pool together and others say no. It seems some chip down the bond beam and others don't. Conceptually although the concrete is thinner for 1.5-2" over the coping gap on the bond beam, you have concrete resting on a nice gunite ledge. This seems like it would be solid.
    Quote Originally Posted by pooldv View Post
    He is correct, don't cut the bond beam. Leaving a couple of inches for the deck to overlap the bond beam is common practice. There are pics of minel in the link in my sig.
    Build thread - 15'x30' rectangular gunite pool; 17,400 gal; 5'x8' spa raised 12" w/ 8' spillover; 10'x6' Baja shelf; Two 18" tall columns w/ 27" water bowls; Light travertine coping w/ Light 2x4' split travertine ledgestone; Jules Rustic Blue tile; Pentair IC60 SWG; Pentair IntelliFlo 2 VST; Pentair SuperFlo 1HP; Pentair CC520 Cartridge filter; Pentair Easy Touch 8 w/ ScreenLogic2; Four Pentair GloBrite; Raypak 406 heater.

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