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Thread: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

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    Nursenini's Avatar
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    Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    We will have 3 scuppers on a 9' x 18" wall. What size/type pump do you recommend for these?

    My PB uses all Hayward products. My guess is that he's planning a 1hp single speed pump.

    Main pool pump is a Tristar VSP, and I believe there is a separate pump for the spa or maybe there's just a blower motor (need to verify this...)

    Thoughts?
    Denise-TFP Guide
    IG 13.6x30 gunite, Radiant Fusion Topaz, 3.6/5.6/4, 14100 gal, 2 skimmer, 4 Hayward LED lights (pool & spa), Hayward Echostar VSP, 2 future fire bowls, raised beam wall w/ scuppers,7x7 raised spa, DE Progrid70, SWG Hayward Goldline, OmniLogic, Hayward 400K BTU heater, stamped colored deck, Dolphin Discovery robotic cleaner, TF100 test kit, Newbie in Bixby Oklahoma

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    Re: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    We also have 3 scuppers on our wall and run a Pentair 3/4hp Whisperflo
    8500 gallon IG Pebble Sheen with Spa. 3hp Pentair VS Intelliflo ( pool ), 3/4 hp WhisperFlo ( water feature ),Pentair Racer, 400K Pentair heater, Pentair 500sqft Cartridge filter, EasyTouch 8, Stenner 45mp2 15gallon wired to ET8

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    Depending on the plumbing run lengths and height of the scupper above the intake, you'd be better off using a waterfall style pump (high volume flow rates at low pressure) than anything like a whisperflo pump which is a high-head (high pressure) pump. Waterfall pumps are also significantly cheaper than standard, single-speed pool pumps. This is an example of what I'm talking about -

    http://www.pentairpool.com/products/...-pumps-191.htm

    In this type of setup, you put your scuppers on a completely separate plumbing loop. There would two, anti-vortex wall drains which feed the suction-side of the pump. The pressure side of the pump is then plumbed to the scuppers. You can add separate shut-off valves to each scupper if you want to be able to control or fine-tune flow. The thing about waterfall pumps is that they are low head and can only draw water up a maximum distance before they lose flow. Typically, the maximum draw height is 10' or so. So that means the wall drains must not be 10' lower than the scuppers. All waterfall pumps will have a pump curve or specs showing their flow rates as a function of draw height. SO you need to match the flow rate of the waterfall pump with the sum of all the flow rates for each scupper. Example - if each scupper has a design flow rate of 25GPM and you have three scuppers, then your pump has to supply a minimum of 75GPM (100GPM to be safe) to satisfy all the scuppers.

    This isn't rocket science but it seems to me that most PBs don't take the time to think about it and just slap an oversized pool pump on anything they can without regard to proper plumbing and water flow. Proper use of a waterfall pump will also save you money as it puts less strain on your pool pump and you can run the scuppers with a more efficient pump.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyfulNoise View Post
    Depending on the plumbing run lengths and height of the scupper above the intake, you'd be better off using a waterfall style pump (high volume flow rates at low pressure) than anything like a whisperflo pump which is a high-head (high pressure) pump. Waterfall pumps are also significantly cheaper than standard, single-speed pool pumps. This is an example of what I'm talking about -

    http://www.pentairpool.com/products/...-pumps-191.htm

    In this type of setup, you put your scuppers on a completely separate plumbing loop. There would two, anti-vortex wall drains which feed the suction-side of the pump. The pressure side of the pump is then plumbed to the scuppers. You can add separate shut-off valves to each scupper if you want to be able to control or fine-tune flow. The thing about waterfall pumps is that they are low head and can only draw water up a maximum distance before they lose flow. Typically, the maximum draw height is 10' or so. So that means the wall drains must not be 10' lower than the scuppers. All waterfall pumps will have a pump curve or specs showing their flow rates as a function of draw height. SO you need to match the flow rate of the waterfall pump with the sum of all the flow rates for each scupper. Example - if each scupper has a design flow rate of 25GPM and you have three scuppers, then your pump has to supply a minimum of 75GPM (100GPM to be safe) to satisfy all the scuppers.

    This isn't rocket science but it seems to me that most PBs don't take the time to think about it and just slap an oversized pool pump on anything they can without regard to proper plumbing and water flow. Proper use of a waterfall pump will also save you money as it puts less strain on your pool pump and you can run the scuppers with a more efficient pump.
    Thanks for the explanation! I love when you answer questions, Matt. You have a gift for teaching.
    I remember the PB telling me that when i was doing the fire/water bowls they would be plumbed separate. I
    believe that is how they do all their water features. I'll be double checking though.
    Denise-TFP Guide
    IG 13.6x30 gunite, Radiant Fusion Topaz, 3.6/5.6/4, 14100 gal, 2 skimmer, 4 Hayward LED lights (pool & spa), Hayward Echostar VSP, 2 future fire bowls, raised beam wall w/ scuppers,7x7 raised spa, DE Progrid70, SWG Hayward Goldline, OmniLogic, Hayward 400K BTU heater, stamped colored deck, Dolphin Discovery robotic cleaner, TF100 test kit, Newbie in Bixby Oklahoma

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    Re: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    I as well am adding 3 wok scupper pots. 2 are about 14" above the water and 1 is 20" above. The plumbing is 3" pvc from the pump to the scuppers. Figuring about 60 to 70 feet of 3"pipe. Guessing about 8- 90's and about 4 -45 degree elbows. Looking at the pentair waterfall pumps. This is a separate designated pump with its own side auction port. Any recommendations for this or if the above poster had any luck with a pump and was it sized correctly.

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    Re: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    My pump is sized correctly for my scuppers. It's a 1 hp pump. The scuppers have just one flow rate. We still don't have the fire/water bowls yet but it looks to me like they will run with the scuppers unless I can get them installed with an actuator, but it's probably too late for that.
    Denise-TFP Guide
    IG 13.6x30 gunite, Radiant Fusion Topaz, 3.6/5.6/4, 14100 gal, 2 skimmer, 4 Hayward LED lights (pool & spa), Hayward Echostar VSP, 2 future fire bowls, raised beam wall w/ scuppers,7x7 raised spa, DE Progrid70, SWG Hayward Goldline, OmniLogic, Hayward 400K BTU heater, stamped colored deck, Dolphin Discovery robotic cleaner, TF100 test kit, Newbie in Bixby Oklahoma

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    Re: Pump recommendations for scuppers on wall

    Is the pump you have a water feature pump?

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