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Thread: Pre-contract Review

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    Pre-contract Review

    Hi All,
    I love this forum. There's so much info. Been reading up as much as I can. I've finally picked a PB and I'm ready to move forward, but would like the more experienced folks add their opinions on the spec's below. I received the initial quote with the pool specs from my builder. Everything seems ok, but I do question the pipe size. He spec'ed out 2" PVC. The equipment will only be about 15' away (straight shot to the pool). Should I ask to upsize to 2.5", or even 3"PVC?

    Also, please feel free to comment on anything else in the spec's shown below. The payment schedule will be revised. I want to add in an automated liquid chlorinator too.


    Pool Specs page 1a.jpg
    Pool Specs page 1b.jpg
    Pool Specs p.2.jpg

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    HI! What a fun and scary time for you!

    Two things stick out at me:

    -uv light cleaning system-------please do some research. That is not as good as they make it out to be.

    -excavated material to be dumped on site----that is a LOT of dirt and will be VERY expensive to remove

    As for your 2" pipe, most of the pools I have watched use 1.5" or move up to 2" BUT I am not an expert on this so......


    For your equipment make sure to get model numbers.

    I would like to see how you rework the payment schedule.

    I look forward to watching you build! Take lots of pictures!

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    Thanks for recommendations. I had researched the UV systems and realize they far underperform any sales claims. I was not going to rely on this which is why I want to add a liquid chlorination system. I need to talk to the PB to see if he will this in lieu of the UV then but wanted to research cost/price differentials first before I had that discussion with him.

    As far as the excavated materials is concerned, that has already been discussed with the PB. That wording will be removed as he is removing all materials, including a few trees that have to be removed at the pool site and along the route to the back yard.

    I am mostly concerned about the final payment on the payment schedule. I don't mind the down payment as it will be due just before the excavation, but I want to move the final payment from 5% closer to 10%. I am supposed to meet with the PB tomorrow so we'll see how it goes.

    If anyone happens to know offhand about the price difference between the UV and a liquid chlorinator, I would really appreciate their input!

    Also, if anyone knows anything recent about QuartzScape I would appreciate their feedback on it too. The PB mentioned that product when I brought up my desire to have a WetEdge or PebbleSheen finish. I've researched the forum and most seem to favor thePebbleSheen, but the posts are a few years old. I'm sure PebbleSheen will be more $$ but I'm not completely opposed to it for a better/more reliable product if the price isn't too much higher (~$1,500). I looked up the QuartzScape website (http://www.nptpool.com/finishes/quartzscapes) but was underwhelmed by the info on it, specifically warranty info.

    Thanks again!

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    JamieP's Avatar
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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    One thing about Quartzscapes compared to the PebbleSheen products is the latter have to be installed by certified crews, whereas anyone who buys from NPT can install the former. Supposedly, especially with quartz products, the quality of the installation directly affects the final look. So, many people like quartz and are happy with it (it's smoothness compared to pebble is often a reason) but finding a good installer is key to avoid streaking and mottling of the color.
    28,000 gallon freeform, Stonescapes Tropics Blue Minipebble with abalone, 3.5' to 8.5' depth. 2 skimmers, 5 returns, dedicated vacuum port, Dolphin Z5 robot. All Pentair equip: EasyTouch 8, IC60 SWG, VS pump, 520 Cartridge Filter, 3 Intellibrites, 2 Color Cascade Bubblers. TurboTwister Slide and 8' Salt System Jump Board. TF-100. My Jan-Mar 2016 build:
    Waxahachie, TX Owner Build - A race to beat the baby!!

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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    I probably have to visit a few recent pools by my PB to get an idea then. I believe this is his base plaster finish when he typically quotes a pool. I'm not sure what led him to list reg. plaster in the quote.

    Other comments/experience still more than welcome!



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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    I just noticed he did list quartz plaster in the orig quote, but did not specify brand.



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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    I really like how you are making sure you know what is up and down. Keep asking questions and taking notes!

    Let us know what he says when you talk to him.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    txnole's Avatar
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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    Without seeing your design, I would wonder about the three skimmers; seems that 1-2 is correct. I would caution buying the robot from the builder, as there is usually a LOT of markup in retail items like this.

    I would also renegotiate your deposit schedule. In my opinion, it's much better to pay more on the front end and hold as much as 10% for up to 30 days following completion or until pool chemical maintenance is turned over to you. No reason to give up your last leverage if something isn't right at the end.
    COMPLETED BUILD THREAD - 15'x29' rectangular offset shotcrete pool; 14,100 gal; 5'x7' raised spa with 400k btu fire feature; 7' spillover; 25' leuder stone raised bond wall w/waterfall; Pentair SWG; Pentair VS (pool); Pentair 3/4hp feature pump; 1hp spa blower; Pentair Cartridge filter; Pentair “Easy Touch 8” wireless; Dolphin Oasis Z5 robot; Solar Hydronics iSwim solar panels; Mansard Screen Enclosure; walnut travertine deck; 1 very happy kiddo.

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Pre-contract Review

    I noticed your decking states "salt finish". I have salt finished walkways and ACID finished decking. Salt finish is not very dense so most of the concrete surface will be smooth, troweled concrete - otherwise known as VERY SLIPPERY when wet.

    I would suggest you change the decking finish around the pool to either an acid etch finish or a sand blasted finish or go with a stamped concrete pattern that has good, non-skid texture.

    Also, are they going to do a true rock-salt applied salt finish or just use a salt finish stamp? In my opinion, stamping a salt finish loses all the random characteristics of hand-applied Rock-salt.


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    Thanks for the feedback! I've exchanged a few emails with the PB throughout the day. I've done quite a bit of research on (competitive) retail pricing and I believe he's being pretty fair on the +/- amounts in the contract for these changes.

    Here's a summary of the changes so far:

    • depth changed to read 4' to 6'
    • all decking to be topped with Sundek (removal of salt finish wording)
    • 3 skimmers changed to 2 skimmers
    • all excavated materials to be removed (along with uprooted trees)
    • added model #'s/names for pool equipment
      • Hayward 3.0 hp EcoStar VSP
      • Hayward 6060 booster pump
      • Hayward H400 heater
      • Pentair Rainbow 320 chlorinator
      • Hayward 320 color changing lights
      • Hayward 550 cartridge filter

    • added sleeves for volleyball net and umbrella (I may not use but he offered them so I took it)


    Here's what I still need/may to cover with him:
    • Revise pmt schedule (I like txnole's suggestion of moving pmts up AND more to the final pmt)
    • View PB's recent QuartzScape pools and determine if i like it or move to something like PebbleSheen or WetEdge Primera
    • Deleting Paramount UV cleaning light
    • Adding automated liquid chlorinator (I need to find the thread on here again where someone added a 15 ga drum and a special, metered pump to compare pricing vs doing this myself)
    • Deleting Polaris 280 cleaning robot and purchase online directly (Amazon or online pool supply?)


    I think that is it for now, although I feel like I'm forgetting something right now. What other accessories am I overlooking?

  11. Back To Top    #11
    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    Has he agreed to the changes in the first set? Was he "happy" to do the changes or is he pushing back?

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    He agreed without any problems/questions. Some were simple oversights (i.e. # of skimmers, decking finish) others he said are normally reflected on the actual construction contract (i.e. model #'s). The oversights kind of bother me because I'm pretty detailed. Apparently he's more detailed with his work than the quotes he gives. He comes highly regarded as a PB.



  13. Back To Top    #13
    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    Have you talked to people he has built a pool for? THAT will tell you all you need to know.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

  14. Back To Top    #14

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    Re: Pre-contract Review

    I talked to the PB and worked out most of the details. I've decided to keep the cleaner and pump so that I have options on cleaners & robots down the road. We revised the pmt schedule to allow for ~8.5% final pmt which works for me.

    I'll probably still delete the UV cleaner and use the credit towards any tile and decking overruns. I've ordered a Stennner pump from Locke Well and a tank. I'll have the plumber install T's and cut off valves for me to install when things are ready to go.

    Let the construction begin!



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