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Thread: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

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    Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    New to TFP, and reading a lot! I tried to find an answer to my problem, but I just find examples of it being asked, and little return on what they did to solve it.



    Instead of a gym with a lap pool, or community pool and hassle, I opted to hunt for a smaller pool to fit in my garage.

    I succeeded (mostly) when I found a Bestway pool on Craig's for $250. After adding on flooring squares to help insulate and protect, and a fair bit of scrubbing, I have it setup, and filtering nicely.

    However, I still have no heat for it. My garage is fully insulated, fully finished, and sits at a pretty stable 60F air temp even with a cold snap here in Portland, OR.

    When I purchased the pool, it came with 3X solar sections, but the practical use of them is problematic because:

    a.) it's winter, and about 37F outside.
    b.) the pool is in the garage on the north side of my house, and the only exposure for any sun is 50+ft away on the other side of my house.

    I don't expect that in my garage, even year-round, I will need a large capacity heater to achieve 2-3-4C/Hr recovery. Eventually my garage will be warm from the pool, and vice versa, seasonally.

    I found this on Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B013LC3IHK/...I2YQY05NEBHG59
    And I could wire this up with a single electrician visit to a nearby 220V box I had installed years ago for a stove. I can mount it to a shelf, hard plump to help protect against movement and temperature, and hopefully provide stable heat year round?

    Thoughts from those experienced in such things?

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Welcome to TFP!!

    No direct experience, but a 3kw heater is not going to heat a lot of water, an dprobably a little on the expensive side.

    I will point out the biggest issues with indoor pools and hot tubs, which you allude to by saying " Eventually my garage will be warm from the pool". This warmth is going to be extremely humid. You are going to have to do something about humidity in this indoor environment or the drywall will be melting off the walls and ceiling.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    thanks for the reply tim5055! I know humidity will become an issue. I plan to keep my pool only moderately "warm" since I am used to swimming in 72-74F temperatures. My garage has an operable window and for now I have added Winterizer Window Film to keep condensation from the cold windows to a minimum (and it's working). I should find a humidity sensor and eventually will install a vent fan. I also cover the pool unless I am using it or cleaning it so I hope to contain humidity with those measures as well.
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    I took the humidity sensor out of a decommissioned Humidor, nabbed a strips of batteries for it (tiny watch type) and set it near my window at the coldest point in the garage. After an evening of sitting it read 48F, and 75% humidity. Research into dehumidifiers begins.

    I am also considering using PVC white pipe left over from my irrigation (I have several hundred feet of 1"+) to build up a "tent" or "cave" over the pool to reduce risk of splashes reaching my Garage door opener and the walls. I will post some pics when I make a test.
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    The problem your going to have will be a the non insulated sides of the pool, a room with an R- value wall and ceiling with a vapor barrier and a stand alone heat source to provide hot air for a heat exchange to heat the pool water is rather simple if feed from the bottom drain of the pool and worked up to the top rail to feed back into the pool, which with all the heat and moisture in that room you would also have to vent it out of the attached garage to avoid black mold from growing in the rafters/ attic area of the garage and house.

    I have an Intex pure spa in my 1/2 basement that the room it is in has a blower that will exhaust the air out of the room when the cover is opened and the spa is in use. The spa maintains a 102 degrees and is always being modified.



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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Been watching my Humidity for a couple days so far:
    cheapo cover ON -Humidity drops about 6% per day. I would imagine this is from the Furnace taking it's air from the Garage. I think I will explore this for a remedy soon. While it helps reduce humidity, it also has the potential to be depositing unwanted chemistry onto my Gas Heating parts.
    cheapo cover OFF -while cleaning, treating, etc. Humidity goes up about 2% per hour.

    I will need more days of tracking and I am shopping for a small peltier driven dehumidifier.
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    I agree with others, one of your biggest challenges is going to be controlling the atmosphere in the garage. Humidity will definitely be a major issue.

    You will need to operate this pool as an indoor pool which means low CYA (20-30ppm) and good FC control. One big issue will be combined chloramine management. CCs stink (literally) and outdoor pools benefit from UV sunlight and open air to help offgas CCs. We don't normally recommend UV systems for outdoor pools but you will likely need one for an indoor pool to help control bather waste. Non chlorine oxidizers, like MPS, can help destroy bather waste without creating CCs.


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    I took some pictures to see what I have done wrong, and pick up any tips that might make the whole project easier come spring time. I am a noob at this so eager for input, and grateful for the items you have already helped point out!

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/cm4k3m7shi...81020.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/0ep09kyfri...81041.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/mb44om4526...81112.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/h9fef7iuub...81247.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ojdpyco02...81409.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/cc95whanxt...81414.jpg?dl=0

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/vwpjstpo01...81457.jpg?dl=0

    All input is appreciated. Got in and cleaned and hung out, and fiddled with my swim/strap/spring/pole/belt rig and I expect to have a swim cap and goggles arrive tomorrow.
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Here's a suggestion - get a Photobucket account and use that to post IMG links to your pictures. The actual images will show up in your posts as opposed to just clickable links (it also makes it more likely we'll actually look at your images )


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    By the way, do you have one of the recommended test kits? No one will be able to help you with chemistry problems if you can't post test results ... and Pool Store testing is a major no-no around here.


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    I have photobucket too so I will post up thumbnails soon. I have test strips and the directions of my pool store test got my numbers good except for chlorine which they said 1oz and I don't have a scale so been creeping up.

    The test strips I got...likely not great but a start and more things for purchase as I go..."leisure time" brand indicate:
    FCl is still only trace and no color on the strip
    Alk is 120 color
    pH is 7.8 color
    CH 250 color.

    I will re-read the testing article for kit to buy.

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    I would suggest you read all of the articles in Pool School, particularly the ones that deal with water chemistry (particularly for indoor pools) and the Trouble Free Pool Care Method. Test strips will be completely inadequate for doing water chemistry maintenance and, just to be clear, you can not mix TFP advice and pool store advice, the two are fundamentally incompatible with one another.

    Good luck with your setup and keep us posted on your progress.


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Understood.

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Please do me a favor and go through the garage with an eye out for safety. I admit I didn't look at all of the photos, but the coiled extension cord over the pool just made me nervous. There really should be no electric within 6 feet of the water and any recepticales in the room should be GFCI protected. I'm going to guess it's less than 42" deep so it is classified as a storable swimming pool so no bonding is required. Water and electricity do not mix.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    @tim5055: as it's inside my garage, and limited space, and I wanted to move around all sides, I had to make some compromises, and aware not to be giving up safety:

    The plug for my pump is GFCI in the cord itself. Anytime I use my "smart" outlet to shut off the pump from my phone app it triggers the GFCI trip as side effect: so I have to manually, in person, reset the button for the pump to fire up at any time.
    I raised all connections up off the floor so even floor splashes have minimal chance to cause electrical problems. I didn't want to run cords on floors, and risk stepping on anything that might get water in a connection.

    That coiled cord is lashed to the 2X4 structure shelving and not "over" the pool, but along the wall almost 2feet to the side. Perspective at fault: but the most practical, and distant, way I could see to keep cords away from puddles in limited space.

    The Blue cord will get retracted back 10+ft away now that I know the GFCI and "smart" outlet work predictably and not some plug/outlet issue. I can tell my Home Automation app that "@11pm, IF Plug is On, THEN turn off" so it never runs unattended overnight until I'm ready.


    I am also in the process of constructing a "tent" that will prevent even slight splashing from having a chance to get to walls/floors, etc. It will be like a tarp gazebo INSIDE the garage, over the pool and with the tarp set so it drains INTO the pool.
    I also have a ceiling-mount Garage door opener to protect.

    Kids are not allowed until it's complete (and then only maybe).

    Got photobucket uploads and maybe better views.
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Out of the box idea:

    One submersible thermometer sensor or a thermometer sensor pad under the pool.

    A thermostat

    A GPM water pump that will pump 25 to 30 gallons a minute.

    A 'endless hot water' heater set to 100...104 degrees...

    Just dawned in my head after seeing your pic's.

    Um, buy a roll of aluminum bubble wrap insulation (R-40+) at Home Depot and make a full floating water cover to keep the temp in.





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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Thanks for reading! I have been reading up on diverter/heater/homebrew ideas, and even considered building a solar trap for the window. As you can see, it's already pretty tight: having another pump, another cord, another set of pipes, etc. is to be avoided.

    I have some home automation gear and one of the thermostats I have considered buying uses little "puck" style remote sensors that I could vacu-seal, stick in the pool, and use for sensor until the batts die periodically. Finding the product with enough capacity and then installing it without long pipe runs all over my garage has been a struggle to figure out.

    Something like this: http://www.zoro.com/rheem-electric-t...Q&gclsrc=aw.ds
    with a diverter valve is possible, but worried that isn't enough hot water for bringing up temps or being a waste of money and time. Specs say 13Kw for only $275?
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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    Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    For the diy idea, a inline pump would work connected to the side bottom drain of the pool, half way up a shoe box Demand hot water heater single feed unit could use a H/D 24 hour timer for now the thermostat and sensors could be added later...(just an Idea)...

    Had a guy way back when in the late 70's in upstate Pennsylvania had an inflatable doom over his full size 26 foot round pool during the winter... Where he got, how he managed it I have no clue...

    But if I could I would...



  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    Um, is to late in the project to drain the pool (Grin and wink) and jack hammer the floor to install a diy solar heater on the roof to heat the cement pad and the pool.....sorry my mind has tossed the same idea in my own garage because of medical issue that have me in a heated pool or warm hot tub 2 or 3 times a day...which is why I have the hot tub in our basement.



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    Re: Bestway (Intex?) AGP in garage, full year solution for heat wanted.

    @Houston144: I have had a friend suggest a floor heat system like in a tile floor...I am trying to stay practical and effective. But I would love to have a heated floor!
    Bestway 18X9? steel frame pool, AG, approx. 4K gallons as of 1/5/2016, sand filter, 1/2hp single speed pump, all set up on foam flooring squares set in my insulated and finished garage.
    Portland, OR USA

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