Acid Dispenser Dilemna

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Joyfulnoise, Amen to that!
I am grateful for all the responses and hope this might help someone else along the way. When my brother rewires (hopefully) the box I'll let you know the outcome. As, I said previously a VS is the optimal solution. Wonder if slightly used pumps have value? Suggestions on which VS to go for? The Jandy with the remote looked handy for an old guy that does not want to bend over a bunch of pipes to read and reset his pump. It appears to have a cabled remote.

As a sidenote, this company also failed to estimate the correct size of the decorative tile wall to not only hide the equipment but also to have it far enough away from the water to be legal (code is 4 feet). Someone in the water cannot touch equipment, so it must be at least 4 feet away. They could not widen the tall part of the wall due to no footers beneath it. We had to come up w the solution and get permission from the city to extend the wall with lattice fence to meet code. Diamond Brite cracked once, redone and now has " Gray Mottling Plaster Discoloration" as in the excellent thread from On Balance dtd 5-17-2012. Oh and all the coping discolored after grouting. Acid washing didn't work to clear it up. They said the sealer would bring out the true colors which would then match our pavers. It did not. Wanted to sue them after shotcreting when I found out the wall was not long enough. The wife refused and did not want to delay. Big mistake.
 
Well, my long suffering readers, I have an update. I now have a functioning Woods timer installed for the Stenner pump - works like a charm. My brother, a journeyman electrician, came back to begin unravelling the mysteries in my timer box. He's in total agreement with ya'll, the job needs redoing. He's still at it, but one HUGE improvement was that by removing one black wire belonging to the SWCG from the Hi-Speed side (last screw on the right) to the Low-Speed timer (second screw from the right) he could get the SWCG to function with the low speed cycle!! This was great news for me, but I have to change my hypothesis of what was going on. I know I am near the minimum flow rate because if I turn on one waterfall the flow rate drops below 40 gpm. Closing the valve puts it over, by how much I don't know, but it's enough that it and the heat pump will function. Really good news!! I am guessing it might be close to the heat pump's optimal flow rate of 48 gpm.

Now, I can work on reducing the high speed from 6 hours down to 3. My actual turnover is 3.3 hours. Should I set it at that or a little more? Enough to for the pool cleaner to remove debris off the bottom, correct??
Also I'll reduce the SWCG from 100% to match the required production which will determine the length of time I need to run on low speed!!! Not having to run the swcg at 100% is supposed to enhance cell life.
This leads me to another epiphany. Water features should have their own pump. We enjoy the aesthetics of the three shears, but for the system to work as I can now see it, their valves need to be closed.
Bad planning on the "experts" part. I can only operate the shears on high speed. The feasibility of that is another whole problem due to minimal space, but not out of the question. Who can I trust with a rational solution?

On low speed the filter pressure gauge registers close to zero. Is that normal?

Thanks fellas.
 
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No charge ;)

Glad you got it worked out. In reference to the high speed run time, turn over means nothing so don't worry about it. I'd only run it long enough for your cleaner to run, if it works ok on low speed then I would forgo the high speed all together.

You are correct about having a second pump for water features. Asking the filter pump to also run water features is taxing and limits what you can run when you want to run it. Post a picture of the pad, lets see if we can squeeze another pump in there.
 
Looks like you could get creative and build a pump stand to place the pump between the 3 suction lines and the heat pump and have it raised above the lower plumbing?

There isn't much room at all. What's on the other side of the heat pump? It also looks like the acid container could move further to the left to make some room?

- - - Updated - - -

Much better! The wiring actually makes sense now!! :goodjob:
 
The acid barrel could be shifted around to the other side of the heat pump and that space on the west side beneath the SWCG control console could contain a pump. How would that be plumbed in? If only the wife would have settled for a 14 foot wide pool! panamax53.jpg
 

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Probably the easiest way would be to use the main drain as the suction (reconnect the skimmer and cleaner line back together for the filter pump), then return the water to the manifold for the 3 sheer descents cutting it out of the loop for the filter pump. This would take a good amount of replumbing but is not out of reason, especially if it is important for you to have the second pump.
 
God, I wish I knew then what I know now......Pool company should have had all this figured out or at least presented options. I cant believe they are installing a lot of the full Jandy automated systems with that same electrician. My wife is in home sales for a builder. Her office no longer sells pool packages through subcontactors due to too many customer complaints and the overwhelming disruptive nature of those unhappy clients screaming in their sales offices. Sad.

While the dilemma of the acid dispenser has been resolved, another dilemma regarding the sheers is upon us. (I'ld like to correct the spelling and change the name of the thread's title)

I can't just shut them off because I'll end up with unsanitary and perhaps algae contaminated lines........right? That's not practical because the wife loves her sheers. They look great, but I don't want to run the pump on high speed all day.
The low speed side of the pump provides way too low a flow rate to create the desired effect.
In order to flush the lines I have to manually turn them on and off for the high speed cycle. They must go off in order for my SWCG and Heat Pump to operate on the low-speed side.

Options:
Continue to manually open and close sheer valves, but adjust Hi-Speed run time to time of day when wife wants them on. Evening? Least effort.
What are the downsides to not having the main drain run through the filter? What if the cleaner is disconnected? Any issues with all the main pump suction going to skimmer?
Would a VS pump resolve this???
 
The main drain actually does very little for circulation, and between the skimmer and MD, the skimmer is far more important. Several pools are built these days with no main drain, it is not required and some feel it is a possible fail point. Being that you have the main drain alleviates the need to tear the pool up to add an additional suction line for a second pump, you could even plumb it so it could be used for either the filter pump or the feature pump.

A lot of this comes down to cost. A second pump definitely adds expense in addition to the extra plumbing and electrical also required so many builders don't even present that option in order to stay competitive.

A VS pump would certainly help, but without some form of automation, you'd still need to go out to the pad and manually crank valves.
 
http://www.inyopools.com/owners_manual/jandy_sheer_descent_waterfall.pdf
Seems to me a copy should have been left for me by the pool builder. The gallonage required for three 24" sheers is substantial according to this. I did ask the builder why he did not install the rock traps. He said they create more problems than they solve. What's your opinion?

I've shut down the heat pump for the next month. The Jandy valve can be turned so as to flow 100% through the bypass or allow some percentage to flow through the heat pump. Where should it be turned to when the heat pump is not being used?
 
panamax53 said:
http://www.inyopools.com/owners_manual/jandy_sheer_descent_waterfall.pdf
Seems to me a copy should have been left for me by the pool builder. The gallonage required for three 24" sheers is substantial according to this. I did ask the builder why he did not install the rock traps. He said they create more problems than they solve. What's your opinion?

I've shut down the heat pump for the next month. The Jandy valve can be turned so as to flow 100% through the bypass or allow some percentage to flow through the heat pump. Where should it be turned to when the heat pump is not being used?
Click to expand...

WASP said:
Surprisingly the shears require a high flow rate to operate properly.
Click to expand...

This is why it is often a good idea to put water features on a separate plumbing loop with their own pump. Typically for open-end (low head) discharge you want to use a waterfall type pump which is lower pressure but high volume.

As for the heater, a month isn't a huge deal if you flush it maybe once per week (close the bypass for a few minutes). Or, if you keep it closed completely, you could drain the heat exchanger if the drain plug is easily accessible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk,16k gal SWG pool (All Pentair), QuadDE100 Filter, Taylor K-2006
 
Every time you go out to mess with the pool, close the bypass for a few minutes and call it good. It doesn't take much water to circulate though the exchanger. Another option since you have a two speed pump is to crack the bypass valve enough to allow some water into the HP but not enough to inhibit the flow to the things that need it...
 
Well, it has been a couple of months and I have good news to report. The acid has settled down to 4 oz a day to maintain a 7.4 pH level. I run the Stenner at the 10 setting for 30 min w a 50/50 mix. The SWCG is often turned off to allow the FC to settle back down. I have the flexibility to run the SWCG for 3 hours on hi speed if I have the sheers turned on or for 10 if they are off (when on there is insufficient flow for the SWCG to run). I am keeping the FC between 5.5 and 7 most of the time. It's beginning to warm up here in S Florida and I'm sure I'll have to adjust things a bit. I have no fear as I'm armed with a good test kit and a trusted advisors on this website. An acquaintance I met told me of a year long battle he's had w algae and how the franchised Pool Store has been selling him a lot of stuff that has not worked. I referred him to TFP and follow the Slamming approach. It worked!! I finally figured out that the pump and SWCG's effect on my electric bill is around $30 - $35 a month. The heat pump in December and January cost us about $220 a month. Even here in S FL it the water gets too cool to be comfortable without being heated and then when it got really cold the heat pump could not keep up without adding considerably more hours of run time. My November bill indicated that running the heat pump that month only cost about $55. It's now March and it might be time to turn it on again if the additional cost can stay between $50 -$75 for the month. We turned the pump off at the end of January after getting the bill. The wife wasn't using it enough to justify paying for heat. Thanks again to everyone.
 
Thanks for the update. You've got your pool well under control. Is there a reason you maintain PH at 7.4? You might be able to further reduce your acid consumption by keeping your PH at 7.6-7.7. Also, keeping your TA lower can reduce PH rise as well, somewhere between 60 and 80 is usually pretty good.

50 bucks a month? Yes. 200? Not so much. Good info.
 
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