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Thread: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

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    LTG's Avatar
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    Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    So is it true that you can't add no more than 2.20 pounds of sodium bicarbonate per 11.000 gallons of water every four days and why? Also is it okay to add chlorine to raise chlorine levels at around the same time i add the sodium bicarbonate?
    Any replies will be appreciated thank you!

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Quote Originally Posted by LTG View Post
    So is it true that you can't add no more than 2.20 pounds of sodium bicarbonate per 11.000 gallons of water every four days and why? Also is it okay to add chlorine to raise chlorine levels at around the same time i add the sodium bicarbonate?
    Any replies will be appreciated thank you!
    Says who?? Let me guess, someone in the pool store told you that?

    2.2 lbs of sodium bicarbonate in 11,000 gallons of water will raise your TA by 14ppm and have almost no effect on pH (goes up by 0.03, so not even measurable). Depending on where your current TA is at, raising the level by 14ppm may or may not be a big deal.

    So, my question to you, why are you asking??
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    And just so that we're clear (because people confuse the two very often), we are talking about sodium bicarbonate (baking soda), NOT sodium carbonate (soda ash or washing soda)? There's a HUGE difference between the two.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    I'm asking because I have to raise the alkalinity to my pool 40 ppm. It's at 40ppm. The pool size is 80.000 gallons. So I think I'll need about 44lb of baking soda if I'm correct.

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Ok, so you want to raise the TA from 40ppm to 80ppm in an 80,000 GALLON (wow, that's a huge pool....public pool??) pool. If that's the case, I get 751oz or 47lbs. That should only raise your pH by ~0.1 units BUT I would highly suggest that you add it in 10lbs or 20lbs increments, allow for the baking soda to mix into the water and remeasure each time (probably need to brush and wait about 45mins or so between additions) to ensure that you hit your target. Of course, if you overshoot, you can easily lower your TA with muriatic acid but you may cause the pH to rise so it's best to proceed slowly.

    By the way, I see your new here so welcome

    Please take some time and look around the site and you'll see we have lots of ways to help you with your pool.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    It's a private swimming school and I'm there facility maintenance guy that in my duties includes maintaining the pools. So is it almost 24oz baking soda for 10 ppm increase per cent 10.000 gallons?

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    So I'm learning in the process

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Check out PoolMath. If you do all your own water testing (we recommend that you use either a TF-100 or Taylor K-2006C), then you can enter your water parameters into PoolMath and get exact chemical dosing info. There's even a section at the bottom of PoolMath called "Effects of Adding Chemicals" which let's you see what effect a specific chemical will have on your pool water.

    Since this is a private swimming school, are you required to be CPO certified? I imagine in CA you probably have certain regulatory requirements as it relates to testing and keeping data logs. We have lots of information on this forum that can help you maintain a great pool so please look around and see what we teach here. You may be required to use certain chemicals that we tend to frown upon (such as stabilized, granular chlorine products) but, as long as we know details about your pool and what you're required to use, we can try to help as best we can. This forum operates mostly for residential pool owners BUT some of our active members are familiar with the operation of commercial pools as well.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Thank you very much for all the info. The boss says that I don't have to be CPO because they have auto fiddling system which can't keep up with the demand so I have to keep adding chems by hand but it keeps the records for the health department. We're using sodium hypochlorite so no problems with conditioner. Were do I add info about pool size etc?

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Check out this Article - Read This BEFORE You Post

    It will give you specifics of what to add to your signature and how to add it.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Why are you targeting 80 ppm for TA? That's probably too high and will cause the pH to go too high. Then you will add acid to lower the ph and the ta will drop with the ph. Then, you add more bicarb and the cycle begins again.

    The correct TA is where the ph remains stable and good.

    If you are required to maintain records for the health department, then you probably need to have a CPO on staff.

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Hi LPG,
    just to mention, both Joyfulnoise and JameW have a pretty heavy background in chemistry. You're in good hands. If you follow their advice, you can't go wrong.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesW View Post
    Why are you targeting 80 ppm for TA? That's probably too high and will cause the pH to go too high. Then you will add acid to lower the ph and the ta will drop with the ph. Then, you add more bicarb and the cycle begins again.

    The correct TA is where the ph remains stable and good.

    If you are required to maintain records for the health department, then you probably need to have a CPO on staff.
    Why is 80 ppm TA to high when the recommended is 80/120PPM?
    It use to be at 90 and the PH it would stay at around 7.5 for the most part and the only way I can tell is because of the acid demand been so minimal. But kinda hard to tell do to a lot of aeration from lap swimming and starting block diving all day long if I am correct

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Quote Originally Posted by Divin Dave View Post
    Hi LPG,
    just to mention, both Joyfulnoise and JameW have a pretty heavy background in chemistry. You're in good hands. If you follow their advice, you can't go wrong.
    Thank you very much DIVIN Dave, good to know

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesW View Post
    Why are you targeting 80 ppm for TA? That's probably too high and will cause the pH to go too high. Then you will add acid to lower the ph and the ta will drop with the ph. Then, you add more bicarb and the cycle begins again.

    The correct TA is where the ph remains stable and good.

    If you are required to maintain records for the health department, then you probably need to have a CPO on staff.
    Also I was trying to go with LSI as my guide and observe the water chemistry and see

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    oops,
    I just notice my typo in your user name on previous post. Apologies for that LTG
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    I didn't but thanks apologies accepted lol

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    TA creates carbon dioxide, which can off gas and raise the pH. If the TA is too high, the ph will rise too much.

    The rule that I find helpful is that if the ph is constantly going too high, then the TA is too high. If the ph is constantly going too low, then the TA is too low. But when the TA is correct for your pool, then the pH will stay within a good range with very little adjustment.

    Does the health department set parameters on the TA?

    Can you post a full set of chemistry readings including water temperature?

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    Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    The health department wants FC between 1-3 and PH between 7.4-7.8 that's all they care
    FC 1-3 during the day due to demand over night I adjust at 5
    CC 0
    CYA 40
    TA 40
    CH 250
    The water temp is at 84f at all times

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    Re: Question about raising alkalinity in my pool using sodium bicarbonate

    With sodium hypochlorite as your primary source of chlorine, I would suspect that a TA of 60 would probably work for you. However, I would suggest the rule I posted above. Try a TA of 60 ppm and a ph of 7.6 to 7.7 and adjust the TA based on whether the pH rises or remains stable.

    Also, a 3 ppm limit on the fc is pretty low. That does not give you much room. I would suggest staying as close to 3 as possible and keep the cya closer to 30.

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