Signed contract last night, deposit paid!

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JamesW said:
I would skip the in-floor cleaner and any chemical automation.

I also would not put a WhisperFlo on a waterfall. WhispewrFlo pumps are designed for high pressure and would be inappropriate for a low pressure application such as a waterfall. The Intelliflo can easily handle the scuppers even at low rpm. How wide and how high will each scupper be? What is the design flow rate for the scuppers?

Is the main drain being tied into a skimmer? It should be run to the equipment pad.

What size pipe will be used for the skimmer lines?
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Thanks for the info on the Whisperflo pumps.

In floor cleaning system seem to work really well here in the Southwest. Our main issue is dirt and dust. I can see where in other areas of the country with large deciduous trees, they may not be as effective. I am still deciding what scuppers to go with 2 24" and 1 36" smooth flow copper scuppers or CMP Natural Wonders Sheer Descent waterfalls (PVC product). Of course the copper scuppers are 4x the price but I like how the water flows out. The copper scuppers have a flow rate (designed) of 20-25 gpm.

The main drain will not be tied to skimmer. It will be plumbed to the equipment pad, since I will have infloor cleaning, the main drain (A&A AVSC) will flow to a very large leaf canister. 2.5" piping
 
lastdon87 said:
Good luck with everything going smoothly! Looking forward to watching your build, and hopefully picking up some tips for myself along the way. One thing I've noticed is most folks here are not fans of the infloor cleaning, but like you, everyone I've talk to in my area highly recommends it. Kind of wierd? Another subject, the SWG seems to be not recommended by builders I've talk to, but fairly recommended on here...oh the choices....lol!
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I was exactly where you are a month ago. I visited 4 major pool builders in the Valley, I had designs and quotes. All of the builders (ALL) tried to steer me away from salt and they were pushing Ozone hard. All 4 builders suggested in-floor cleaning. So I starting digging and talking to folk and found that most that have in-floor here in the valley are very happy with it. I have a pool before, and tried several different cleaners and they were all had their issues. We shall soon see about in-floor.

Ultimately, I decided to go with a Owner build. The main driving force behind my decision is the amount of work we are doing in addition to the pool. We are putting a large permanent patio on the house (house currently has aluminum patio) we are adding a pergola and large seating wall. Also going with all new landscape (Plants, irrigation and lighting). I have a friend that is a contractor, he has built many pools and has a short list of subs that he has worked with for many years. He has deals negotiated so there should be no haggling. Basically, he is going to be a project manager and oversee the entire project for a small percentage. Numbers are in and overall, I am saving a little over $9k even after paying him. After researching, it seems that if you have the time, an owner build can get you so much more for your money.

My estimates from the 4 big guys were at $41-44k for a smaller pool, with 1/2 the decking and 1 LED light.

- - - Updated - - -

JamesW said:
Is the 20 to 25 gpm per scupper or for all three?
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That is what the design from the manufacture says....
 
A WhisperFlo is not a good choice for a waterfall. It's a high head pump and it will run off it's head curve. It will be noisy and use way too much power.

If you decide to get a separate pump for the scuppers, I would suggest a waterfall pump or a small variable speed pump.
 
azjoshers79 said:
I talked to my contractor and he is telling me the Pentair VS intelliflo will be plenty for the scuppers. The process is getting complicated! Lol


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I have to ask this...................who should you listen to??? PB who is selling you stuff OR people who have no real interest other than to help you get what you NEED to do the best job. People who have lived with and used the products.

Just a thought.

Kim
 
azjoshers79,

Yes, the IntelliFlo can handle it. But the bigger question is, do you want the IntelliFlo doing the work?

You see, the more "stuff" you hook up to the VS pump, the higher the baseline pumping speed you'll need to maintain to keep everything running. At some point, if you start running everything from the VS pump, you'll never be running it at its lower speeds and you'll lose all the energy savings advantages.

I would really get a waterfall pump to run the scuppers. A good Pentair waterfall pump is not going to add much cost and you'll get the benefit of having the scuppers on a completely separate schedule and running them as-needed (parties and look). Believe me, you do not want them running all the time from a water chemistry standpoint.


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kimkats said:
I have to ask this...................who should you listen to??? PB who is selling you stuff OR people who have no real interest other than to help you get what you NEED to do the best job. People who have lived with and used the products.
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IMO this is excellent advice. As someone who just recently went through the process you're going through. I WISH I'd reached out and asked the questions your asking now when I built my pool this past summer. If I had I wouldn't be in the position I'm in now.

Here's my situation - http://www.troublefreepool.com/threads/101833-Need-Expert-Advice-on-Replacing-Water-Feature-Pump-in-Brand-New-Build

Not exactly the same as my need is to run my pots separate (at times) from my scuppers. But the advice portion is what I'm referring to. I can tell you my Whisperflo is major overkill for 2 scuppers and a 48" sheer descent. Good luck!
 
kimkats said:
I have to ask this...................who should you listen to??? PB who is selling you stuff OR people who have no real interest other than to help you get what you NEED to do the best job. People who have lived with and used the products.

Just a thought.

Kim
Click to expand...

I agree but I am not using a big pool builder, I am doing an owner build with a friend of mine that is a contractor, he has built over 100 pools and he will be managing the project. So I can better understand, if I have the Pentair easy touch panel I should be able to run each function separately? I will not need to run the scuppers when the pool is just cleaning and making chlorine?? Everything will be plumbed on separate runs.


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The EasyTouch is only going to have four (4) dedicated valve relays. Two are dedicated to the POOL and SPA circuits and two (VALVE A & VALVE B) are open to control valves. Also, the valves are only programmable to open one way or the other (in the case of a three-way valve). There is no partial open or split-ratio control.

Yes, if you get the IntelliTouch option with remote WiFi control, you can program some sophisticated valve and pump schedules.

I run my waterfall off of one of the eight 240/120VAC relays to turn on and off the waterfall pump. That is why I like it, it's a simple on/off relay command and doesn't involve any sophisticated logic control of valves. As well, the more automated your valves are the greater the wear and tear on the valve gaskets.

I still would recommend a separate pump.


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JoyfulNoise said:
The EasyTouch is only going to have four (4) dedicated valve relays. Two are dedicated to the POOL and SPA circuits and two (VALVE A & VALVE B) are open to control valves. Also, the valves are only programmable to open one way or the other (in the case of a three-way valve). There is no partial open or split-ratio control.

Yes, if you get the IntelliTouch option with remote WiFi control, you can program some sophisticated valve and pump schedules.

I run my waterfall off of one of the eight 240/120VAC relays to turn on and off the waterfall pump. That is why I like it, it's a simple on/off relay command and doesn't involve any sophisticated logic control of valves. As well, the more automated your valves are the greater the wear and tear on the valve gaskets.

I still would recommend a separate pump.


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Click to expand...

There is an easy touch panel with 8 circuits. It's a little more expensive but there are more options. I want to be able to control everything, water and lighting


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azjoshers79 said:
There is an easy touch panel with 8 circuits. It's a little more expensive but there are more options. I want to be able to control everything, water and lighting


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Click to expand...

That's what I'm talking about.

I have the 8-circuit panel. It's eight (8) 120/240VAC relays. The valves are not controlled by those eight relays. The valves are typically controlled by the four (4) on-board valve controls which are 24V relays. Two are dedicated to the POOL and SPA circuits and two are free (called VALVE A & B in Pentair-speak).

So you can program feature circuits which activate those four valve relays or some of the eight 120V relays. But the 120V relays don't typically drive the automated valves.


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azjoshers79 said:
I am going to discuss adding a separate waterfall pump. Are these loud??


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Click to expand...

You should probably keep it all in one thread. Otherwise it's going to get messy trying to refer to things going on in multiple threads.


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JoyfulNoise said:
You should probably keep it all in one thread. Otherwise it's going to get messy trying to refer to things going on in multiple threads.


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Click to expand...

You are right, I have bounced all over the place in this thread. It's just I am in the planning stages and want to get it right the first time. So many questions, I have owned a pool before but never built one.


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Just so you know, the standard EasyTouch comes with 4 low voltage valve actuators. They are actually called SUCTION, RETURN, VALVE A and VALVE B. Obviously those first two are intended to control the suction and return automated valves (which assumes a POOL and SPA feature setup). The other two are optional. Pentair typically used VALVE A for solar heater valves.

You can also purchase an additional valve expansion card which allows you to add on three (3) more valves.

So, if you think your are going to need more valve control than what is standard, you need to purchase that expansion card or specify it when you ask Pentair to build your LoadCenter.


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