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Thread: Calcium Hardness High

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    Calcium Hardness High

    My CH level are currently 550PPM and it has increased from 450 PPM 45 days ago. How can I lower it? Should I try to lower it? I have read other old threads where was indicated that it's ok as long as it does not go over 600 PPM and other chemical levels are good. Any truth to this? My other chemical levels are good. I tested my tap water and the readings were 175 PPM.
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Pool School - Recommended Levels

    Here is the chart for what TFP says.

    The only way I know of to lower CH is to remove and replace water.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    True that the only way to lower is to drain water and water with lower CH. There are people on TFP who manage CH in the 800-1000 range. Keep your CSI in range using the Poolmath calculator.
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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    What Chlorine type should I select? I have a SWG.



    Quote Originally Posted by pooldv View Post
    True that the only way to lower is to drain water and water with lower CH. There are people on TFP who manage CH in the 800-1000 range. Keep your CSI in range using the Poolmath calculator.
    - - - Updated - - -

    Thanks for the reply.


    Quote Originally Posted by kimkats View Post
    Pool School - Recommended Levels

    Here is the chart for what TFP says.

    The only way I know of to lower CH is to remove and replace water.

    Kim
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Regular fill water in NJ, at least my town is not hard. Maybe in Union, it is different. When I travel to Kenilworth, I will test the water.

    It appears that possibly you or previous owner may have used Cal Hypo Tablets or Cal Hypo Shock as part of a program. I know that you have a SWG at this moment, but was this always the case? Maybe a little bit of history of ownership, how you maintained pool, time, etc. would be helpful. CH will come down slowly by replacing water.

    Please test your city water to determine what levels you have for TA & CH? Curious how it compares down here. We have NJ American Water Company in Monmouth County. Please keep us posted!
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Hi!

    I just built my pool last year and only used liquid Chlorine for the first 30 days as the plaster was curing, as the pool builder advised me I could not use the SWG during the first 30 days. I also have NJ American water and the PH is 6.8 and the CH is 170.




    Quote Originally Posted by Catanzaro View Post
    Regular fill water in NJ, at least my town is not hard. Maybe in Union, it is different. When I travel to Kenilworth, I will test the water.

    It appears that possibly you or previous owner may have used Cal Hypo Tablets or Cal Hypo Shock as part of a program. I know that you have a SWG at this moment, but was this always the case? Maybe a little bit of history of ownership, how you maintained pool, time, etc. would be helpful. CH will come down slowly by replacing water.

    Please test your city water to determine what levels you have for TA & CH? Curious how it compares down here. We have NJ American Water Company in Monmouth County. Please keep us posted!
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Quote Originally Posted by RESISTENCIA13 View Post
    Hi!

    I just built my pool last year and only used liquid Chlorine for the first 30 days as the plaster was curing, as the pool builder advised me I could not use the SWG during the first 30 days. I also have NJ American water and the PH is 6.8 and the CH is 170.
    Something is just not adding up. If your fill water is 175, which is exactly what I come up with, but ph I believe is something different and I will test later tonight, then how could your levels have gone from 175 to the figures you have posted? Have you kept track of CH over the months or did you have water trucked in? Could this possibly be a side effect of something else with plaster? Or is this possibly testing error or bad reagents ? Please tell us how you are testing and what test kit you are using? And has your level been increasing?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Are you testing with one of the recommended test kits, or are these results from other sources?
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    I filled my pool last year using my house water. I use the TF-100 Kit for testing, which I purchased in June of this year. CH level have been increasing since June as my first CH test on June 15 was 350PPM. I did not worry as I was told that as water was being add it, rain water, etc the CH levels will come down. Also I have read other threads with people stating levels of up to 800 are ok as long as everything else is ok. I have never replace the water since the pool was built last year, beside topping it off after backwashing or to replace evaporated water, now that closing time is near I want to make sure my water chemistry is good to avoid potential issues when reopening next year.

    As far as testing error, I am following the instructions on the test and reagents shall be good as they were just purchased in June 2015. However, I am open to any testing tips/suggestions.





    Quote Originally Posted by Catanzaro View Post
    Something is just not adding up. If your fill water is 175, which is exactly what I come up with, but ph I believe is something different and I will test later tonight, then how could your levels have gone from 175 to the figures you have posted? Have you kept track of CH over the months or did you have water trucked in? Could this possibly be a side effect of something else with plaster? Or is this possibly testing error or bad reagents ? Please tell us how you are testing and what test kit you are using? And has your level been increasing?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Are you testing with one of the recommended test kits, or are these results from other sources?
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Wow, you have me puzzled on this one. Let's backtrack a little:

    Q: Your pool was built when? Month and Year?
    Q: You filled up your pool at same time it was built with house water (which registers CH @ 175), correct?
    Q: From inception, how did you test the water, prior to the TF-100 Test kit? Did you add anything in the pool that you can remember? How often were you testing?
    Q: You are using a 10 ml. sample, then 10 drops of R-0010 and mixing. Then adding 3 drops of R-01011L and mixing. Red should indicate calcium. Then one drop at a time of R-0012 until color changes to blue. Then multiply by 25.

    Outside of this, what I would recommend is to take 2.5 gallons of pool water and 2.5 gallons of house water and mix. Then test CH and you should actually have the average of 175 and your current reading of 550, somewhere around 350 to 375. This way you can validate the testing to make sure that nothing is wrong with the reagents. Once you validate this test, maybe go to Chemistry 101 and hopefully someone with a little more knowledge on what could have caused this issue. If asking directly about CH, please post a very detailed timeline of CH levels so they can be followed. Possibly label it as "Trying to figure out why my CH is constantly rising".

    I would plug in all your numbers in Pool Math and determine if you are within the ranges of CSI. I have seen where people have high CH levels, but if I remember correctly you have to keep an eye on PH and some other levels.
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Sorry duplicate! Also, are you using the speed stir? Please read this post from Richard320. Maybe we uncovered something.

    Calcium Hardness increasing
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Answers are below:


    Your pool was built when? 08/2014
    Q: You filled up your pool at same time it was built with house water (which registers CH @ 175), correct? Yes
    Q: From inception, how did you test the water, prior to the TF-100 Test kit? Yes Did you add anything in the pool that you can remember? No How often were you testing? every 3 days for FC and PH, every week for everything else.
    Q: You are using a 10 ml. sample, then 10 drops of R-0010 and mixing. Then adding 3 drops of R-01011L and mixing. Red should indicate calcium. Then one drop at a time of R-0012 until color changes to blue. Then multiply by 25. Yes


    I did the pool math and my CSI is -0.31. I am not using a speedstir, but I do take my time mixing the water to avoid false reading. I will try the 2.5 gallons of pool and house water idea and see what happened. That is a great idea...Thanks



    Quote Originally Posted by Catanzaro View Post
    Wow, you have me puzzled on this one. Let's backtrack a little:

    Q: Your pool was built when? Month and Year?
    Q: You filled up your pool at same time it was built with house water (which registers CH @ 175), correct?
    Q: From inception, how did you test the water, prior to the TF-100 Test kit? Did you add anything in the pool that you can remember? How often were you testing?
    Q: You are using a 10 ml. sample, then 10 drops of R-0010 and mixing. Then adding 3 drops of R-01011L and mixing. Red should indicate calcium. Then one drop at a time of R-0012 until color changes to blue. Then multiply by 25.

    Outside of this, what I would recommend is to take 2.5 gallons of pool water and 2.5 gallons of house water and mix. Then test CH and you should actually have the average of 175 and your current reading of 550, somewhere around 350 to 375. This way you can validate the testing to make sure that nothing is wrong with the reagents. Once you validate this test, maybe go to Chemistry 101 and hopefully someone with a little more knowledge on what could have caused this issue. If asking directly about CH, please post a very detailed timeline of CH levels so they can be followed. Possibly label it as "Trying to figure out why my CH is constantly rising".

    I would plug in all your numbers in Pool Math and determine if you are within the ranges of CSI. I have seen where people have high CH levels, but if I remember correctly you have to keep an eye on PH and some other levels.
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Quote Originally Posted by RESISTENCIA13 View Post
    Answers are below:I did the pool math and my CSI is -0.31. I am not using a speedstir, but I do take my time mixing the water to avoid false reading. I will try the 2.5 gallons of pool and house water idea and see what happened. That is a great idea...Thanks
    At least you are within ranges for your CSI. I definitely recommend the Speed Stir. Maybe that is why you are testing high. Only thing I can think of. The only other item is that if calcium was too low in the beginning, that calcium from the pool surface can dissolve into the water, causing pitting and deterioration.

    Pool School - Calcium Scaling

    You also stated that your test kit came in this year, but the pool has been around for a whole year prior to this. Were you testing with something else from when pool was built to when you received the test kit? From August of 2014 to June of 2015, is it possible that your calcium levels were lower than you thought and calcium from the pool surface was dissolving into the water? If you were using test strips, they could read falsely high. Then maybe without the speed stir, you are getting a high reading.

    You have a pool that requires accurate testing for CH and PH and the speed stir sure seems to be the next step.
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Last year, I was using pool store and strip testing. I will get the speedstir and see what happens. Thanks



    Quote Originally Posted by Catanzaro View Post
    At least you are within ranges for your CSI. I definitely recommend the Speed Stir. Maybe that is why you are testing high. Only thing I can think of. The only other item is that if calcium was too low in the beginning, that calcium from the pool surface can dissolve into the water, causing pitting and deterioration.

    Pool School - Calcium Scaling

    You also stated that your test kit came in this year, but the pool has been around for a whole year prior to this. Were you testing with something else from when pool was built to when you received the test kit? From August of 2014 to June of 2015, is it possible that your calcium levels were lower than you thought and calcium from the pool surface was dissolving into the water? If you were using test strips, they could read falsely high. Then maybe without the speed stir, you are getting a high reading.

    You have a pool that requires accurate testing for CH and PH and the speed stir sure seems to be the next step.
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Quote Originally Posted by RESISTENCIA13 View Post
    Last year, I was using pool store and strip testing. I will get the speedstir and see what happens. Thanks
    Please get the speed stir to rule out high CH. The test strips are really bad and while sometimes pool stores come close on some testing, they always seem to be higher/lower and you can only trust your own testing. Remember that you will not "sell yourself" any chemicals that are needed. Keep us posted.
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    I ordered the speed stir and will let you know the out come as soon as it arrived. Thanks for your help.


    Quote Originally Posted by Catanzaro View Post
    Please get the speed stir to rule out high CH. The test strips are really bad and while sometimes pool stores come close on some testing, they always seem to be higher/lower and you can only trust your own testing. Remember that you will not "sell yourself" any chemicals that are needed. Keep us posted.
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Quote Originally Posted by RESISTENCIA13 View Post
    I ordered the speed stir and will let you know the out come as soon as it arrived. Thanks for your help.
    Once you receive your speed stir and test the water, please post results. We can then only come to once conclusion. When the pool was built and your testing was done with test strips, in addition to pool store testing, because of CH being low, calcium was forming in the pool water from the plaster. This is the only thing that it could be as your water CH is around 175 (exactly what I tested here). Keep your CSI in check, and slowly you will lower your CH by rainfall and adding new water as time goes on. By next season you should be fine.

    I know my CH started at 225 and was down to 175 at one point. It appears that rainfall is not hard and neither is city water. I did add calcium only due to the fact that I had some laying around and another 5 lb. bucket to keep in ranges of what PB states is the lowest. This is only for a warranty reasons for the next year or so. Calcium is not that expensive either.
    14,700 gallons IG Pool Vinyl Liner - Octal Circulation System
    Hayward Pro-Series 350 LB. Sand Filter Model # S270T - 2" Plumping
    Hayward CL2002 Chlorinator - Hayward Super Pump 2 HP Model # k48m2n111
    Hayward AQR9 SWG 25K Salt Cell & TF-100 Test Kit + Speed Stir
    Gulfstream HE125RA - 117K BTU Heat Pump - Date of Build is 11-2013

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Quote Originally Posted by RESISTENCIA13 View Post
    What Chlorine type should I select? I have a SWG.
    Choose SWG, it is one of the options.
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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    I wouldn't get too excited over 450 CH.

    You drain down a bunch for the winter and you'll get rain and snowmelt in there, too.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Is not one of the options.

    Quote Originally Posted by pooldv View Post
    Choose SWG, it is one of the options.
    - - - Updated - - -

    It's 550PPM not 450PPM.



    Quote Originally Posted by Richard320 View Post
    I wouldn't get too excited over 450 CH.

    You drain down a bunch for the winter and you'll get rain and snowmelt in there, too.
    20,000 Gallons, 33.9 x 19.9 free form inground plaster pool 7 feet deep with Spillover Spa, Salt Generator (Fusion Soft),Heat Pump, Single Speed 2 HP Pump, D.E. Filter. Zodicac PDA, IQ900RS Controller.

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    Re: Calcium Hardness High

    Quote Originally Posted by RESISTENCIA13 View Post
    Is not one of the options.



    - - - Updated - - -

    It's 550PPM not 450PPM.
    It still doesn't matter. 550 is easily managed if you keep tabs on pH and TA. You'll be draining a whole bunch soon for winterizing, will you not?
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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