[AG] Deep Freeze Winterization of Splash Omega 20 Pool

[Cain]

Hello,

We recently acquired a house that came with an Splash Brand Omega 20 pool. This pool holds 9000 gallons according to the website:

::SPLASH SUPERPOOLS::

http://www.splashpools.com/getFile.asp?fileName=SplashPoolManual2.pdf

it has a 75gpm pump and uses a Cartridge based filter system, possibly a bad PSI gauge.

Being North Dakota, it can get beastly cold so I am looking for info on how to properly winterize this pool, based on questions I have come up with from reading the TFP guide.

So lets get it going!

1. Drain water to 6" below lowest return/skimmer opening and hoses/fittings removed.

QUESTION:

On this pool, I see the return line from the filter as well as the part where the water goes into the pump / filter combo which is described in the manual as the intake, and there is a area that is plugged probably 6 to 12 inches (maybe a bit more, memory here) above it which from the manual is the skimmer hold down. The manual says to drain below the Return Fitting, should I go with that or the skimmer opening that is plugged?


2. Skimmer/return plugs or "gizmos" may be installed or they may be left open - this is a personal choice for each pool owner

QUESTION:

What exactly are "gizmos" and what exactly do they do and there advantages / disadvantages?


3. A polyquat algaecide may be administered per dosing instructions on product (optional.) Distribute evenly with brush, leaf rake or leaf skimmer.

QUESTION:

- What is a specific algaecide recommended?

- What should be looked for / avoided in a chemical list for an algaecide?

- When can this be applied exactly (not sure if what was listed was in order)?


4. Drain filters/pump well and remove pump, hoses and fittings. Inspect all items for evidence of damage or excessive wear and plan to order replacements before spring.


QUESTION:

- When draining a Catridge based filter, what is the best method? (stand upside down, etc) and how long?

- Also, any use in storing these say indoors where its temp controlled or is that over kill?


5. Remove muti-port/spider gasket. Smaller fittings, hardware and filter drain plugs can be stored inside pump pot basket - lube pump pot basket with silicone lube. Remaining pump hardware can be placed inside gallon zip-lock bag and taped to side of pump.


QUESTION:

Looking in the manual for the pool, I don't see something described this way but could be wrong? In this case, anyone have any ideas?


6. If using a winter cover, install per manufacturers instructions (i.e., pillows and anchoring)


QUESTION:

- For this, what exactly is the difference between say a specific "winter cover" versus a cover? Reason I ask is the previous owner mentioned they go through covers (and others in the area) in like 1 year like its common. But I think its not a true "winter" cover.

- I have heard of a cover that lets water seap through or something to that affect, is there one such as that and thoughts on it?

- I also noticed that there are these metal "plates" around the permitter of the pool as if it was used to strap to. anyone know what these are? (I will post a pic later when I get the chance)

- Are there a particular brand of pillows to use that are good? I have heard of people using inner tubes and filled (or not?) empty bleach bottles, any info on that?


7. Pool Antifreeze:

QUESTION:

- What do you recommend for a specific brand and / or stuff to look for in the ingredients?



GENERAL QUESTION:

- We have an algae problem due to I believe CYA high levels, does it pay to clean and refill now or just due it after winterization and in the spring?

I appologize for all the questions, I am trying to figure all this out in a quick timeframe as I figure by mid or so September we will start this winterization process, heck, probably won't get in the pool at all it looks like due to the issues

 

[cvgnus]

Hello,

We recently acquired a house that came with an Splash Brand Omega 20 pool. This pool holds 9000 gallons according to the website:

::SPLASH SUPERPOOLS::

http://www.splashpools.com/getFile.asp?fileName=SplashPoolManual2.pdf

it has a 75gpm pump and uses a Cartridge based filter system, possibly a bad PSI gauge.

Being North Dakota, it can get beastly cold so I am looking for info on how to properly winterize this pool, based on questions I have come up with from reading the TFP guide.

So lets get it going!

1. Drain water to 6" below lowest return/skimmer opening and hoses/fittings removed.

QUESTION:

On this pool, I see the return line from the filter as well as the part where the water goes into the pump / filter combo which is described in the manual as the intake, and there is a area that is plugged probably 6 to 12 inches (maybe a bit more, memory here) above it which from the manual is the skimmer hold down. The manual says to drain below the Return Fitting, should I go with that or the skimmer opening that is plugged?


2. Skimmer/return plugs or "gizmos" may be installed or they may be left open - this is a personal choice for each pool owner

QUESTION:

What exactly are "gizmos" and what exactly do they do and there advantages / disadvantages?


3. A polyquat algaecide may be administered per dosing instructions on product (optional.) Distribute evenly with brush, leaf rake or leaf skimmer.

QUESTION:

- What is a specific algaecide recommended?

- What should be looked for / avoided in a chemical list for an algaecide?

- When can this be applied exactly (not sure if what was listed was in order)?


4. Drain filters/pump well and remove pump, hoses and fittings. Inspect all items for evidence of damage or excessive wear and plan to order replacements before spring.


QUESTION:

- When draining a Catridge based filter, what is the best method? (stand upside down, etc) and how long?

- Also, any use in storing these say indoors where its temp controlled or is that over kill?


5. Remove muti-port/spider gasket. Smaller fittings, hardware and filter drain plugs can be stored inside pump pot basket - lube pump pot basket with silicone lube. Remaining pump hardware can be placed inside gallon zip-lock bag and taped to side of pump.


QUESTION:

Looking in the manual for the pool, I don't see something described this way but could be wrong? In this case, anyone have any ideas?


6. If using a winter cover, install per manufacturers instructions (i.e., pillows and anchoring)


QUESTION:

- For this, what exactly is the difference between say a specific "winter cover" versus a cover? Reason I ask is the previous owner mentioned they go through covers (and others in the area) in like 1 year like its common. But I think its not a true "winter" cover.

- I have heard of a cover that lets water seap through or something to that affect, is there one such as that and thoughts on it?

- I also noticed that there are these metal "plates" around the permitter of the pool as if it was used to strap to. anyone know what these are? (I will post a pic later when I get the chance)

- Are there a particular brand of pillows to use that are good? I have heard of people using inner tubes and filled (or not?) empty bleach bottles, any info on that?


7. Pool Antifreeze:

QUESTION:

- What do you recommend for a specific brand and / or stuff to look for in the ingredients?



GENERAL QUESTION:

- We have an algae problem due to I believe CYA high levels, does it pay to clean and refill now or just due it after winterization and in the spring?

I appologize for all the questions, I am trying to figure all this out in a quick timeframe as I figure by mid or so September we will start this winterization process, heck, probably won't get in the pool at all it looks like due to the issues

I have an above ground pool with some similarities so I will do my best to address your questions. We have some cold winters here but not nearly as brutal as ND.
If when your pump is off and the gauge does not read zero it is an indication of a failed gauge. Is this the case?

1. From what I can see from the manual I believe you should lower the water to 6" - 12" below the return (H). However I think the skimmer assembly should be removed (since it appears to be inside the pool) and the ball valve (O) closed and plugged if at all possible.

2. Here is a link to a gizmo. I do not use gizmos and do not have an opinion. I have all PVC piping and prefer to blow out and plug all open pipes. In your case I really think the skimmer should be removed to reduce the chance of damage since your pool will likely completely freeze. But your manufacturer may have other ideas.

3. You should look for the following in a Polyquat 60, Poly [ oxyethylene(dimethyliminio) ethylene(dimethyliminio)ethylene dichloride ] and is at least 60% polyquat. Or any product with similar chemicals and starts the word 'poly'.
-Polyquat should be added after you bring and hold your pool at shock level for at least 24 hours. Follow the dosing instructions on the label.

4. I have a DE filter but what I would suggest is that you tear down your filter and clean it. At this time you can inspect it for issues and allow it to dry. Once it is completely dry you can re-assemble and can store it outdoors (covered of course) or indoors.

5. I don’t think you have a multiport but if you have any rubber gaskets for instance the pump basket cover it should be lubed. Do not use petroleum jelly or anything similar. It should be a lube specifically for pools. In addition your pump should also be flushed, completely drained and stored in a place where it will not freeze.

6. The difference between a cover and winter cover could mean solar cover vs. a winter cover. There are many opinions on whether to cover your pool for the winter at all or use a winter cover or mesh cover. I personally prefer to use a winter cover. There is some work involved with a winter cover as you will need to pump water off it and shovel snow off it (use a plastic shovel). With a winter cover you will have less debris in the pool and less worry about algae starting as long as you close when the average daily temp is below 60 degrees and open before average daily temps are above 60 degrees.
A heavy oversized winter cover with a high scrim (threads per square inch) count may help the cover survive longer. If you over size a bit the cover will lay on the water and have less pressure around the edges when the snow and ice is on it.

I can’t comment on the plates you mention until I can look at a pic.

The higher the mil thickness of a pillow the better. Not sure of brands though. I use two smaller pillows rather than one larger one in the event one breaks or loses air. The inner tube sounds like a possible idea but I am not sure about the bleach jugs as they may end up cracking in the frozen water.

7. Sorry I have no experience with antifreeze and I am not sure where you would use it in your instance.

What is a high CYA? Can you post some numbers? High CYA does not cause algae. Inadequate amounts of free chlorine allow algae to start growing. I can tell that you need to SLAM the pool before you think about closing otherwise you may be opening a swamp next season. If your CYA level is unmanageable you may need to replace water.

I hope I was able to at least answer some of your questions and get you going.

 

[Cain]

I have an above ground pool with some similarities so I will do my best to address your questions. We have some cold winters here but not nearly as brutal as ND.
If when your pump is off and the gauge does not read zero it is an indication of a failed gauge. Is this the case?

Thanks for the responses!

For the gauge it goes to zero when off, but it seems to never really go up at all, even when we have run the pump for awhile and you can tell the filter is pretty dirty looking. wonder if there is a way you can force it to "move" to test?

1. From what I can see from the manual I believe you should lower the water to 6" - 12" below the return (H). However I think the skimmer assembly should be removed (since it appears to be inside the pool) and the ball valve (O) closed and plugged if at all possible.

There is no skimmer on the pool, the previous owner never had one and it just has a plug there where the assembly would "hold" the skimmer into place. after spending part of the morning getting it out manually, I will probably get one for next year.

As for the ball valve, I'll talk to the previous owner and see what he did though its odd in the manual it says this:

Slice/Ball Valve should be opened to allow it to drain. (The valvecan be removed, but must be free of water for the winter.)

So if its open (you turn the handle), doesn't that allow water out? Are they saying this because you need to plug the wall from the other side (they don't say to plug in the manual)

2. Here is a link to a gizmo. I do not use gizmos and do not have an opinion. I have all PVC piping and prefer to blow out and plug all open pipes. In your case I really think the skimmer should be removed to reduce the chance of damage since your pool will likely completely freeze. But your manufacturer may have other ideas.

Thanks. They say to remove the skimmer but I have no skimmer, already plugged so it should be okay. I am more curious though as to what exactly the skimmer is supposed to do as the description on that link, the reviews seem to contradict what it says?

3. You should look for the following in a Polyquat 60, Poly [ oxyethylene(dimethyliminio) ethylene(dimethyliminio)ethylene dichloride ] and is at least 60% polyquat. Or any product with similar chemicals and starts the word 'poly'.
-Polyquat should be added after you bring and hold your pool at shock level for at least 24 hours. Follow the dosing instructions on the label.

4. I have a DE filter but what I would suggest is that you tear down your filter and clean it. At this time you can inspect it for issues and allow it to dry. Once it is completely dry you can re-assemble and can store it outdoors (covered of course) or indoors.

5. I don’t think you have a multiport but if you have any rubber gaskets for instance the pump basket cover it should be lubed. Do not use petroleum jelly or anything similar. It should be a lube specifically for pools. In addition your pump should also be flushed, completely drained and stored in a place where it will not freeze.

Thanks!

6. The difference between a cover and winter cover could mean solar cover vs. a winter cover. There are many opinions on whether to cover your pool for the winter at all or use a winter cover or mesh cover. I personally prefer to use a winter cover. There is some work involved with a winter cover as you will need to pump water off it and shovel snow off it (use a plastic shovel). With a winter cover you will have less debris in the pool and less worry about algae starting as long as you close when the average daily temp is below 60 degrees and open before average daily temps are above 60 degrees.
A heavy oversized winter cover with a high scrim (threads per square inch) count may help the cover survive longer. If you over size a bit the cover will lay on the water and have less pressure around the edges when the snow and ice is on it.

the cover I am looking at based on another thread here with similar winter conditions is this:

Closing AG pool using cover where it freezes solid

Rugged Mesh Winter Pool Cover Above Ground | PC Pools

Based on the description and what I read on another thread, it sounds like it may fit the bill for what I need and also last longer I am thinking? Or, is just a regular winter cover that is oversized more than enough to do the same thing? and speaking of which, how much "oversize" is recommended if do you go bigger to have it sit in the water?

I can’t comment on the plates you mention until I can look at a pic.

The higher the mil thickness of a pillow the better. Not sure of brands though. I use two smaller pillows rather than one larger one in the event one breaks or loses air. The inner tube sounds like a possible idea but I am not sure about the bleach jugs as they may end up cracking in the frozen water.

I'll get some pics of the pool once I get a good camera here (wife's phone ironically) and post to show what i am seeing for plates. As for pillows I'll have to search online for pics of where these go as I have never seen anything like this at all before so wouldn't know where to begin.

7. Sorry I have no experience with antifreeze and I am not sure where you would use it in your instance.

What is a high CYA? Can you post some numbers? High CYA does not cause algae. Inadequate amounts of free chlorine allow algae to start growing. I can tell that you need to SLAM the pool before you think about closing otherwise you may be opening a swamp next season. If your CYA level is unmanageable you may need to replace water.

I hope I was able to at least answer some of your questions and get you going.

For the antifreeze not sure really for usage, I saw it on a few different google posts so was curious and after doing more research it appears its maybe more for the lines, etc?

As for the CYA,I have another thread about it in the first timers section. It was basically over 150 I think (I only have strips right now, but TF100 on the way) so I wasn't surprised after learning more that it went green on me. I have been doing what I can working with bleach and filtering and that seems to have helped a lot, I basically just have a few "lines" of algae at the bottom of the pool but the rest looks clear. I also drained it about half way as I figured besides the CYA to cycle the water through the filter would take less time too if what I am thinking is correct.

But the previous owner was using bags of "Shock" at least once a week I think and had those floating tablets of chlorine as well which from what I am understanding raise CYA. Weirdly, at least to me, when I took that tab stuff out and just have been using bleaching and measuring a best I can, I noticed the CYA dropped from what the strips are saying which may not be much, but its definitely different.

 

[cvgnus]

Thanks for the responses!

For the gauge it goes to zero when off, but it seems to never really go up at all, even when we have run the pump for awhile and you can tell the filter is pretty dirty looking. wonder if there is a way you can force it to "move" to test?

I am not sure how to test the gauge but if the gauge is suspect I would replace it. It is a critical item to help monitor your filter and pump. It is relatively inexpensive and can be found at TFTestkits.net

There is no skimmer on the pool, the previous owner never had one and it just has a plug there where the assembly would "hold" the skimmer into place. after spending part of the morning getting it out manually, I will probably get one for next year.

As for the ball valve, I'll talk to the previous owner and see what he did though its odd in the manual it says this:

Slice/Ball Valve should be opened to allow it to drain. (The valvecan be removed, but must be free of water for the winter.)

So if its open (you turn the handle), doesn't that allow water out? Are they saying this because you need to plug the wall from the other side (they don't say to plug in the manual

The manual makes sense in that if water were to sit in the valve and were to freeze you could risk cracking it. It should be plugged from the pool side and be left open (my bad) or removed as you suggest. Interesting they dont state that.

Thanks. They say to remove the skimmer but I have no skimmer, already plugged so it should be okay. I am more curious though as to what exactly the skimmer is supposed to do as the description on that link, the reviews seem to contradict what it says?

The skimmer does just that. It skims the surface water of debris. Consider replacing it as it is part of the original design of the pool. But this is the first time I have seen a skimmer inside the pool.

Thanks!



the cover I am looking at based on another thread here with similar winter conditions is this:

Closing AG pool using cover where it freezes solid

Rugged Mesh Winter Pool Cover Above Ground | PC Pools

Based on the description and what I read on another thread, it sounds like it may fit the bill for what I need and also last longer I am thinking? Or, is just a regular winter cover that is oversized more than enough to do the same thing? and speaking of which, how much "oversize" is recommended if do you go bigger to have it sit in the water?

NWMNMom appears to have a good method for closing in her instance. Its all about preference. I have used my method for three seasons with no damage and good results for me. But I do have work to do during the winter with draining the cover and shoveling. The mesh cover you are looking at appears pretty good and well oversized (4' overlap) but may not be that necessary. If you decide to go with mesh you likely will not need an air pillow (otherwise known as ice compensator). When you have a solid cover and ice begins form on it, it tends to push out rather than up as with the water in the pool. So as the ice expands the air pillow compensates. If you go with a solid cover 4' overlap should be a minimum.

I'll get some pics of the pool once I get a good camera here (wife's phone ironically) and post to show what i am seeing for plates. As for pillows I'll have to search online for pics of where these go as I have never seen anything like this at all before so wouldn't know where to begin.



For the antifreeze not sure really for usage, I saw it on a few different google posts so was curious and after doing more research it appears its maybe more for the lines, etc?

Yes likely and probably more for hard piping that has the risk of water accumulating in the bends of the pipe.

As for the CYA,I have another thread about it in the first timers section. It was basically over 150 I think (I only have strips right now, but TF100 on the way) so I wasn't surprised after learning more that it went green on me. I have been doing what I can working with bleach and filtering and that seems to have helped a lot, I basically just have a few "lines" of algae at the bottom of the pool but the rest looks clear. I also drained it about half way as I figured besides the CYA to cycle the water through the filter would take less time too if what I am thinking is correct.

CYA at 150 is unmanageable. You should try to get it to 70 or below, ideally 50 or below and SLAM. The strips are notoriously inaccurate. Wait for the TF-100 before you do any more water replacement. I would suggest adding about 1/2 bottle of chlorine/bleach per day and brush ,brush, brush until your kit arrives. I am sure the good people in the forum are guiding you in your other thread.

But the previous owner was using bags of "Shock" at least once a week I think and had those floating tablets of chlorine as well which from what I am understanding raise CYA. Weirdly, at least to me, when I took that tab stuff out and just have been using bleaching and measuring a best I can, I noticed the CYA dropped from what the strips are saying which may not be much, but its definitely different.

Again I wouldnt trust the strips. When time allows you should read up on how to do the CYA test. Its very subjective and does require some practice and correct lighting.

 

[Cain]

alright some news.

I went ahead and ordered that cover as well as this kind of wrap that goes around to take up slack. It is like a plastic wrap almost in a way based on there (the pcpool people) recommendation for the type of pool I have.

I also ordered a winterization plug since I think the plug the previous owner was using was used to plug the skimmer mount portion and i need one for the return line.

As for chemicals, any place that has cheap good polyquat "60".

 

[Cain]

winterization plug came in. still waiting on the cover.

Gonna be a could dip it looks like to put the plug in and do all the shock and stuff lol.

 

[Isaac-1]

Wow what timing, I can't really help on the winterizing as we don't do that here, but by some chance I was just looking up the record low for Fargo ND a few minutes ago (I have a friend that also lives in West Fargo that I was talking to yesterday), and it appears to be -36 F set about 10 years ago.

 

[LFrankow]

This is what I plan on doing with my ABG pool.
Maintain FC levels until final shock perhaps add some algecide since I have a bit and never use it anymore.
Cover until leaves are gone then store cover.
Bring FC to shock levels as per Pool Math, you are miles ahead of me as I cannot get a TF-100 being in Canada. Drain pool to 6" below lowest outlet, remove and store ball valves if possible, if not leave in the open position as water trapped in a closed ball valve will cause the valve to freeze and crack even metal valves.
Spring as soon as water gets close to liquid start adding bleach hoping to keep it clean from green, if not fully drain, scrub with a high bleach content solution, then refill using Pool Math.
Hoses pumps etc. rinsed with a very strong bleach solution before storing indoors and before using in the spring.
Too late for us to SLAM if we can get the water cheap enough, mine costs me 94 cents a cubic meter so pretty cheap to fill my pool about 40-60$
Anti-freeze very cost prohibitive but if I could get 6000 gals for free I might try it.

 

[Cain]

Be cool to trade notes with another pool owner in the area!

yeah its still pretty warm here so its working out.

Alright here are my levels right now:

FC - 6.5
CC - 0.0
CYA - 35 - 40 (what is best to error on here? thinking 40 since you just add a bit more chlorine)
TA - 240
PH - 7.8

My PH is high because the water when the pump isn't running has a slow leak on the:

- input to the filter / pump (hose doesn't tighten up enough)
- Very very small leak on the plug wall that is to hold the skimmer (will be buying a skimmer next year)
- A slight drip when I close off the ball valve

But I would say the main leak area is the hose to the pump. I found that if I run the actual line into the pool no issues since I think its gravity driven too.

As I needed to drop the pool a bit, hasn't been too much of a concern.

Anyway, it looks like the cover is here too. I am waiting right now on the Algaecide as well which I am thinking will be here end of this week or early next week.

in the meantime I am going to bring the pool up to shock level and hold it close to that.

I think the only thing I am still iffy on is should I work to drop my PH and work on dropping the the TA since the return line is not under a water line anymore. But since I am winterizing the pool, does it matter?

 

[Cain]

Polyquat came in so I have all I need here.

Need to read up a bit more on when to do this as I thought there a temp you need to consistently see, though, wasn't sure if it was in the water or not.

Plan to keep up the SLAM level till sunday and maybe winterize then.

 

[Cain]

alright I winterized my pool and put on the cover.

I may have needed to buy a larger size as I missread the discription and the level I dropped it to is a bit lower than what they said as the minimum, so I may see about adding in some water to bring it up a bit.

I will say I wish there were more grommets on the cover as they appear like they were placed in locations that made sense, however, when I got all around the pool I had a couple of sections that didn't exactly match up to the pool "legs" so I kind of fudged it. At the end I had like excess of pool cover so I put that sort of "together" in a bunch. I think next year I'll maybe keep that in mind and spread it out more around the pool.

 

[Cain]

I did the plastic wrap thing that pcpools recommended, the concept makes sense, however in practice with this cover it slid and popped free up top if done in the manner they show in pictures. I ended up doing a below-the-deck wrap instead.

Also, since my cover isn't as big as I probably should have ordered, I ended up putting more water into the pool.

I also ended up running a line on the ball valve as from what I can tell its probably leaking and with a hose on it going "up" I think it will help keep things in order there. Most likely next year I'll need to see about possibly a new ball valve setup