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Thread: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

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    Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    My question is this. What is everyone doing to combat high water temps (90-94F) and keep your PH in balance. I know that there is no simple or easy way. Otherwise everyone would do it.
    Thru reading on this forum and learning from others the process that I know for my situation with a SWG which naturally raises PH is this. My thought process as follows-
    Check PH first and lower as necessary to 7.2, then use my homemade fountain to aerate to help cool the water. Then monitor the PH and TA to determine how many hours of aeration I can get before PH gets to high (above 7.8).
    Is there anything that I am missing or better solutions? Bathtub water is not very relaxing. Oh BTW my pool gets full sun from 10AM till 8PM. Right now the best swim time for us is after the sun goes down.
    12 x 26 Viking FG IG, Bermuda Model, 3 1/2' to 5', 7000 Gallons, Diamond Series Maya, Hayward 1 1/2 HP Maxflo VS, Hayward Stay Clear Plus Cart Filter C17502(S), Hayward Aqua Rite SWG w/T3 cell, Color Changing FIBERSTAR Lighting, Aqua Bot Supreme Robotic cleaner, Brushed Concrete with CCI Liberty Tan color, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Armor Foundation penetrating concrete sealer(lifetime warranty).

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    A tarp and some rope to rig a sunshade would help you a lot.

    You've already discovered evaporative cooling through aeration and the pitfalls of it.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard320 View Post
    A tarp and some rope to rig a sunshade would help you a lot.

    You've already discovered evaporative cooling through aeration and the pitfalls of it.
    Then shade thing was my first thought. My wife is not too crazy about the idea.
    Ya I kinda thought so. I was hoping someone had a more efficient way.
    12 x 26 Viking FG IG, Bermuda Model, 3 1/2' to 5', 7000 Gallons, Diamond Series Maya, Hayward 1 1/2 HP Maxflo VS, Hayward Stay Clear Plus Cart Filter C17502(S), Hayward Aqua Rite SWG w/T3 cell, Color Changing FIBERSTAR Lighting, Aqua Bot Supreme Robotic cleaner, Brushed Concrete with CCI Liberty Tan color, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Armor Foundation penetrating concrete sealer(lifetime warranty).

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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    I am thinking about a shade sail, it would be more aesthetic.

    Intex Ultraframe, 24' x 52", 1.5hp Matrix 2 speed, 21" Hayward sand filter + Intex Ozone Saltwater System, through-wall skimmer, 1.5" PVC return fountain. Taylor K-2006 & K-1766 test kits.

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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    I am looking for something aesthetic pleasing that would be semi permanent. Installed in the summer, taken down in the winter.
    12 x 26 Viking FG IG, Bermuda Model, 3 1/2' to 5', 7000 Gallons, Diamond Series Maya, Hayward 1 1/2 HP Maxflo VS, Hayward Stay Clear Plus Cart Filter C17502(S), Hayward Aqua Rite SWG w/T3 cell, Color Changing FIBERSTAR Lighting, Aqua Bot Supreme Robotic cleaner, Brushed Concrete with CCI Liberty Tan color, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Armor Foundation penetrating concrete sealer(lifetime warranty).

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    Quote Originally Posted by rmturner54 View Post
    My question is this. What is everyone doing to combat high water temps (90-94F) and keep your PH in balance. I know that there is no simple or easy way. Otherwise everyone would do it.
    Thru reading on this forum and learning from others the process that I know for my situation with a SWG which naturally raises PH is this. My thought process as follows-
    Check PH first and lower as necessary to 7.2, then use my homemade fountain to aerate to help cool the water. Then monitor the PH and TA to determine how many hours of aeration I can get before PH gets to high (above 7.8).
    Is there anything that I am missing or better solutions? Bathtub water is not very relaxing. Oh BTW my pool gets full sun from 10AM till 8PM. Right now the best swim time for us is after the sun goes down.
    Depending on what your other water parameters (TA being the most important one for this exercise), driving your pH that low may be counterproductive. As you drive the pH that low, you will consume a lot of alkalinity and then the subsequent rise from 7.2-7.6 will be fast and 7.6 to 7.8 slower. You'd better off getting your TA and pH to stable point by lowering the TA to a level where the pH rise is minimal. Then the aeration you're considering will have less effect on the pH. It's tempting to believe that by going lower in pH then you get more "runway" for the pH to rise in. The problem is, pH rise is not linear. The pH rise from 7.0 to 7.5 happens at a faster rate than the pH rise from 7.6 to 8.0.

    As well, excessive aeration (think very tiny droplets like a spray or mist) can cause calcium scaling if the CH is high enough. When you create tiny water droplets, the chemistry of the water changes quite a lot since the surface area to volume ratio of the water droplet is much larger. This is why here in Arizona where almost every outdoor restaurant patio has misters installed and they are completely caked up with calcium scale.

    So, in short, you have a good idea about using a fountain to cool the water, but you may want to adjust your approach to the pH and TA. Post water test results and a better analysis can be performed.
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyfulNoise View Post
    Depending on what your other water parameters (TA being the most important one for this exercise), driving your pH that low may be counterproductive. As you drive the pH that low, you will consume a lot of alkalinity and then the subsequent rise from 7.2-7.6 will be fast and 7.6 to 7.8 slower. You'd better off getting your TA and pH to stable point by lowering the TA to a level where the pH rise is minimal. Then the aeration you're considering will have less effect on the pH. It's tempting to believe that by going lower in pH then you get more "runway" for the pH to rise in. The problem is, pH rise is not linear. The pH rise from 7.0 to 7.5 happens at a faster rate than the pH rise from 7.6 to 8.0.

    As well, excessive aeration (think very tiny droplets like a spray or mist) can cause calcium scaling if the CH is high enough. When you create tiny water droplets, the chemistry of the water changes quite a lot since the surface area to volume ratio of the water droplet is much larger. This is why here in Arizona where almost every outdoor restaurant patio has misters installed and they are completely caked up with calcium scale.

    So, in short, you have a good idea about using a fountain to cool the water, but you may want to adjust your approach to the pH and TA. Post water test results and a better analysis can be performed.
    I started with a PH of 7.8 and TA of 110. I added enough MA(12oz) to bring PH down to 7.4 and TA to approx 100.
    12 x 26 Viking FG IG, Bermuda Model, 3 1/2' to 5', 7000 Gallons, Diamond Series Maya, Hayward 1 1/2 HP Maxflo VS, Hayward Stay Clear Plus Cart Filter C17502(S), Hayward Aqua Rite SWG w/T3 cell, Color Changing FIBERSTAR Lighting, Aqua Bot Supreme Robotic cleaner, Brushed Concrete with CCI Liberty Tan color, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Armor Foundation penetrating concrete sealer(lifetime warranty).

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    Quote Originally Posted by rmturner54 View Post
    I started with a PH of 7.8 and TA of 110. I added enough MA(12oz) to bring PH down to 7.4 and TA to approx 100.
    You still have lots of TA to play with. Try to get it down to 70ppm and then I think you'll really see your pH stabilize and hold at 7.6-7.7 for long periods of time. It will also allow you to run you water cooler for longer periods.


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Best way to combat high water temps and drive PH thru the roof

    Ok. I was leaning that way. And thsnks for the input. Ill work on getting ta down
    12 x 26 Viking FG IG, Bermuda Model, 3 1/2' to 5', 7000 Gallons, Diamond Series Maya, Hayward 1 1/2 HP Maxflo VS, Hayward Stay Clear Plus Cart Filter C17502(S), Hayward Aqua Rite SWG w/T3 cell, Color Changing FIBERSTAR Lighting, Aqua Bot Supreme Robotic cleaner, Brushed Concrete with CCI Liberty Tan color, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Armor Foundation penetrating concrete sealer(lifetime warranty).

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