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Thread: Omnilogic Questions

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    travisr100's Avatar
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    Omnilogic Questions

    For those who may have some insight... I sent the following questions to Hayward.

    I'm in the process of building a pool and have some questions about the Hayward Omnilogic as well as pumps. My builder has installed the Omnilogic.

    The pool is a 16x32x4 deep. It is an in ground pool/spa combination.

    I will do my best to explain the current plumbing. My builder has used an Ecostar pump for the main pump. He has used a Tristar SP3210EE for the water features pump. I have two water features. One is a pair of lion heads that basically have a 3/4" pipe where they spit out water. The other is a pair of Pentair LED color bubblers. The water feature pump pulls from the main drain. On the output side the water goes to a "T." The left T goes to a diverter valve and to the lions. The right T goes to a diverter valve and to the bubblers. With the Omnilogic I can set up the lions and bubblers as separate features. During setup I would assign each of the features to same pump and to their respective diverter valves. So far, so good I believe. I would be able to turn on each respective feature individually or both on at the same time. Am I call correct here?

    The issue I have is that if I turn on one feature it's going to get 100% of the flow from the pump. If I turn on both features each will get only 50% of the flow. I want to be able to turn on one or both and have the flow be the same to each feature whether I'm running both features or only one. The obvious solution is to use a variable speed pump. I was looking at the Tristar SP3202VSPND. My understanding is that this pump works with the Omnilogic, correct? Assuming so, what I would need to do is program the Omnilogic such that if one feature is running run the pump at 50%. If both features are running run the pump at 100%. Is it possible to do that? Reading through the installation manual I don't see how that's possible.

    I have Color Logic 4.0 lights installed. It says they must be run in standalone mode. How can I change the preset colors? Am I limited to the preset colors with Omnilogic? Seems a backward step.

    I have travertine coping and decking so I do not want to use a salt water generator. I am having the Sense and Dispense intalled using the AQL-CHEM3 acide feeder. For chlorine I have opted to go with a stenner tank system and dispense liquid chlorine. From looking through the Omnilogic manual there doesn't seem to be any way to use the ORP sensor to automate the stenner pump for chlorine dosing like I can do with acid. Is that the case? Assuming so, how would I best set this up? Set up the stenner pump as a filter pump or a feature? And to prevent dosing chlorine without the main pump running I would interlock the stenner pump to the main filter pump?
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    travisr100's Avatar
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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Anyone with omnilogic done this? Assigned multiple features to the same pump?
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    You could try using themes, use one theme with the pump at 50% and one feature on, then create another theme with the pump at 100%. That should work.

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    travisr100's Avatar
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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Thanks. I had thought about that but wasn't sure if it would work. Thinking that if my filter pump is on and I choose a theme like that it will also turn the filter pump off.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    If you set the theme up with your filter pump on, then it will continue to run. This is my understanding of the themes, I have not tried to set any yo yet either, but I plan to someday

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    I have an omnilogic, and I've set up a "theme" for my waterfall that throws a particular valve actuator (to steer water to the falls), and increases the pump to max speed. The theme definitely stores the pump speed. When you turn the theme off it goes back to the default pump speed (i.e. whatever the schedule dicates). Thus I'm sure you can set up one theme with 50% pump speed, and another theme with 100% pump speed...

    If I'm not understanding the question / issue let me know and I may be able to elaborate.
    ~25000 gal IG gunite pool, built 2001 - renovated 2015
    Pebble Sheen Blue Surf + Shimmering Sea, Gemz, Classic Pool & Tile Rodio waterline
    Grey Granite Paver Deck, with TechoBloc Blu60 Smooth accent strip
    Hayward OmniLogic, UCL and CL320 LED lights, DE6020 filter, EcoStar pump, TF-100, T-15 SWG, Raypak P406A heater

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    travisr100's Avatar
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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Thanks a lot for the information you guys have given me. While I was making some other posts I got a popup that I had a PM. It was the Hayward rep that occasionally posts on these forums giving me his number and asking me to give him a call. I have to say, this was the most knowledgeable guy I've talked to so far on Omnilogic. Far better than any of the Hayward support people I've gotten when I called their main number. He spent about an hour on the phone with me going over all my questions regarding the Omnilogic. I finally understand how I've got to set some of this stuff up for my particular situation. Even better he gave me a rundown on some new products and features they're going to be coming out with for Omnilogic. At this point, totally thrilled I chose this. Can't wait for some of this stuff to come out.

    That phone call just sold me on Hayward.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by travisr100 View Post
    Even better he gave me a rundown on some new products and features they're going to be coming out with for Omnilogic. At this point, totally thrilled I chose this. Can't wait for some of this stuff to come out.
    Can you share any details?
    ~25000 gal IG gunite pool, built 2001 - renovated 2015
    Pebble Sheen Blue Surf + Shimmering Sea, Gemz, Classic Pool & Tile Rodio waterline
    Grey Granite Paver Deck, with TechoBloc Blu60 Smooth accent strip
    Hayward OmniLogic, UCL and CL320 LED lights, DE6020 filter, EcoStar pump, TF-100, T-15 SWG, Raypak P406A heater

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    On new stuff? He swore me to secrecy.

    I was just happy to have a rep actually care to spend an hour on the phone with me going over in minute detail every question I had. I wish every Hayward rep they had was like this guy. The others I've talked to left me fairly unimpressed. This guy knew his stuff. Customer service like that is hard to come by these days. I know this was just one guy in a big company but sometimes that's what it takes.

    I can say that they sound like they have big plans for Omnilogic. Every time I took him down a path of how to make it do something it didn't currently do he had an answer with a new product addition or firmware upgrade that would be forthcoming to address the issue.

    For instance, I thought it was ridiculous that they have this controller with an ethernet connection yet for me to upgrade firmware I've got to power off the whole panel, remove the dead front, and plug in a USB stick. That's really pretty sad. He said they're already working on a future firmware to have it upgrade over the Internet without me having to power down and take it apart.

    Other features I wanted he said they already have in firmware that they just haven't released yet.

    I'll definitely be posting a detailed review of the Omni once I get a chance to spend some time with it.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Did he mention any better control of the ColorLogic 4 LED lights?

    Thanks

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Yes and no. I had the rep I called at their main number share the following so I assume it's not a big secret. That rep told me that at some point they are coming out with a module that will connect to the Omni giving the same control of the CL lights that you would have with the prologic automation system. The rep from here said the same thing BUT he said that module would require the Universal Color Logic Network lights for the control to work. I currently have the Color Logic 4.0 120v lights which it sounds like won't work. My PB is swapping out my lights and putting in the Universal CL low voltage network lights just to be on the safe side. The rep from here also told me the UCL lights have more standard preset colors and light shows in standalone mode than the 4.0 lights and that the UCL low voltage lights are twice as bright.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by travisr100 View Post
    Yes and no. I had the rep I called at their main number share the following so I assume it's not a big secret. That rep told me that at some point they are coming out with a module that will connect to the Omni giving the same control of the CL lights that you would have with the prologic automation system. The rep from here said the same thing BUT he said that module would require the Universal Color Logic Network lights for the control to work. I currently have the Color Logic 4.0 120v lights which it sounds like won't work. My PB is swapping out my lights and putting in the Universal CL low voltage network lights just to be on the safe side. The rep from here also told me the UCL lights have more standard preset colors and light shows in standalone mode than the 4.0 lights and that the UCL low voltage lights are twice as bright.
    Thanks, that's useful info. I am in the process of starting a pool renovation, so I may just wait on the lights at this point until all that is sorted out.

    It also sounds like they hopefully are addressing some of the UI nits that were noted in this thread:

    OmniLogic one-month review

    Can you comment in a general sense as to whether these kinds of things are in the works based on your conversation?

    Thanks.....
    ~25000 gal IG gunite pool, built 2001 - renovated 2015
    Pebble Sheen Blue Surf + Shimmering Sea, Gemz, Classic Pool & Tile Rodio waterline
    Grey Granite Paver Deck, with TechoBloc Blu60 Smooth accent strip
    Hayward OmniLogic, UCL and CL320 LED lights, DE6020 filter, EcoStar pump, TF-100, T-15 SWG, Raypak P406A heater

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    We didn't really get into those UI bugs since I haven't yet powered up my panel and had a chance to play with it yet. Hopefully that happens today. From looking at the latest firmware release notes they have a pretty good list of bugs they know are still an issue and they're working on. From looking at the history it seems like they're releasing new firmware fairly regularly which is encouraging. If they want this product to be a hit that's what it's going to take. I'm definitely going to post my reviews as well once I get it going.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Thanks. Very confusing for sure. They really need to slim down their portfolio of controllers, lights, etc.

    I have to see what was just installed in my pool last week, I know they are CL 4 LED lights, but not sure if they are Universal or not. Of course the box is gone, wonder how to tell.

    I just fired my omnilogic up last week, It was on the latest FW already, looking at firmware download page seems they have only released one since the release, granted it was in the past few months. But hopefully more will be coming.

    J
    31k Gallons, Gunite, Hayward HP, Pump and Omnilogic, TCell 15, Sense & Dispense, C02

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    Yup, I have CL 4, not universal. Its hard to spend a lot of money on an antiquated relay based control system.
    31k Gallons, Gunite, Hayward HP, Pump and Omnilogic, TCell 15, Sense & Dispense, C02

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    That's kind of a bummer. Antiquated relay? What else is there?
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    I think my point is the pool industry has been slow with innovation. I would expect at this point for a $1000 LED pool light to have some sort of instant control such as Hue of LIFX lights. Or a better interface in conjunction with the controller system (omnilogic, prologic, aqaua+, etc) Today, they way the work is cycling through the choices by powering them on and off through a relay, which is slow, causes sync issues, etc.

    J
    31k Gallons, Gunite, Hayward HP, Pump and Omnilogic, TCell 15, Sense & Dispense, C02

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    My understanding is that's what the new controller board is for.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    I've had my Omni up and running for about 4 days now. I installed a new relay myself for the Stenner tank so I got to do some wiring inside the box. I also installed a new flow switch in anticipation of adding the S&D system. So here are a few things on my wish list...

    1. The web interface will let you "do a survey" which is basically where you can log test results and the interface will show you your CSI based on the data. It will also show you your current ORP and pH. The iPhone and iPad interfaces are missing this functionality. Particularly on the iPad there is plenty of room for this.

    2. For those of you using bleach and a stenner tank like I am, there's a lot of functionality that's missing. You set the Stenner tank up as an accessory in the Omni. That's easy enough. I think it would be easy to add an interlock to the main pump to ensure the main pump comes on any time the Stenner comes on. This at least prohibits pumping bleach while the main pump is off. What's missing is that there's no way to set a max run time on an accessory. If my wife or kid accidentally turned on the Stenner it would run the tank dry and pump 15 gallons of bleach in my pool. That wouldn't be good. It would also be nice to tie the accessory to a flow switch. Even with the interlock it would be nice to confirm there is water flow before injecting bleach. And lastly with the S&D I have no idea when the system is dispensing acid. I'd hate to dispense acid and bleach into the return line at the same time. Currently it would just be a hope and pray situation that the S&D doesn't dispense acid when the bleach is running.

    3. And the reason I didn't play with setting an interlock between the Stenner and the bleach is that all configuration has to be done at the main panel. Standing there in the 100 degree sun isn't very conducive to taking your time to look at all the options. Why in the world wouldn't they allow configuration from at least the web interface?
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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    Re: Omnilogic Questions

    I found another odd thing. Just sent the following to Hayward...

    I recently plumbed in a Hayward GLX-FLO flow switch just as protection for my pump. I do not have a SWG. When playing with the pump speeds this morning I noticed that when I put the pump down to 20% I got an alarm on the OmniLogic web and phone interface saying "No Water Flow FlowSensor ." I sped the pump back up but the message remains. There is no way to clear it. I tested the switch and I know that it is working properly. Why won't this message clear once flow is restored? It must be actually seeing flow since it hasn't shut the pump off to protect it after I raised the speed back up. How do I clear the message? How low a flow can I have and still get the switch to sense it? If I'm using this to simply protect the pump from a no water condition it would seem that if I use this flow switch that I can't run at very low speeds because the Omni is going to shut off the pump because of no flow when indeed there is flow.
    IG 13,000 gal, WetEdge Prism Matrix Indigo Blue, Hayward C4030 cartridge filter, Hayward Ecostar VS main pump, Hayward Tristar VS feature pump, Hayward OmniLogic, Hayward Sense & Dispense (pH only), Stenner 45MPHP22 bleach, Hayward H400FDN Heater, Hayward Color UCL lights, Pentair LED Bubblers. TF-100 XL test kit. Test Results. Build Thread.

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