Well, I'm hosed

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restoman

restoman

Well-known member
Dec 24, 2010
168
Murrieta, CA
A few days ago I noticed my Jacuzzi wasn't turning on with all the other pumps. (I have the Jacuzzi and the waterfall set to run 15 minutes each, once a week just to keep the algae down)

So I started investigating and when I turn the Jacuzzi motor on, it hums but doesn't turn on, so I figured a bad start/run capacitor mounted on the top of the motor (see attached). I swapped the Jacuzzi and waterfall capacitors around (both rated the same - 50MFD at 370VAC) and while the waterfall still worked, the Jacuzzi still didn't. Hums but it doesn't turn on. So it's not the capacitor unless there's another one I don't know about. I looked at a few YouTube videos and some motors have a capacitor inside, but I don't think mine does. The Jacuzzi motor is a Whisperflo model WFE-8 (I believe it's P/N 011515) rated at 2HP and runs at 230VAC.

I removed the little access door on the back of the motor and was able to turn the shaft freely, so the motor isn't locked up. Also note that if I leave it on for 15-20 seconds, it makes a slight "pop" noise, stops humming, but it DOESN'T throw the circuit breaker.

Since it's not the capacitor on top of the motor, I'm assuming I have a bad motor?

And in California, you can no longer get these single speed motors, so I have a choice to make:

1. Buy a new 2 speed motor for around 2 grand (which I don't have)
2. Leave the circuit breaker OFF until I can round up the money

Ed
 

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  • Jacuzzi pump run capacitor.jpg
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restoman said:
A few days ago I noticed my Jacuzzi wasn't turning on with all the other pumps. (I have the Jacuzzi and the waterfall set to run 15 minutes each, once a week just to keep the algae down)

So I started investigating and when I turn the Jacuzzi motor on, it hums but doesn't turn on, so I figured a bad start/run capacitor mounted on the top of the motor (see attached). I swapped the Jacuzzi and waterfall capacitors around (both rated the same - 50MFD at 370VAC) and while the waterfall still worked, the Jacuzzi still didn't. Hums but it doesn't turn on. So it's not the capacitor unless there's another one I don't know about. I looked at a few YouTube videos and some motors have a capacitor inside, but I don't think mine does. The Jacuzzi motor is a Whisperflo model WFE-8 (I believe it's P/N 011515) rated at 2HP and runs at 230VAC.

I removed the little access door on the back of the motor and was able to turn the shaft freely, so the motor isn't locked up. Also note that if I leave it on for 15-20 seconds, it makes a slight "pop" noise, stops humming, but it DOESN'T throw the circuit breaker.

Since it's not the capacitor on top of the motor, I'm assuming I have a bad motor?

And in California, you can no longer get these single speed motors, so I have a choice to make:

1. Buy a new 2 speed motor for around 2 grand (which I don't have)
2. Leave the circuit breaker OFF until I can round up the money

Ed
Click to expand...
Pop/motor-hum stopping is the overheat switch kill power to the windings (which are probably burned out), and stopping a fire.
If you were to install a 1.5hp Whisperflo impeller (you likely wouldn't notice any difference in flow), then you could use a Century EVO EVQ225 motor ($625.00+/-). The motor will work with a relay and can be programmed to run full speed for at least the time a spa would be in use.
Don't know why the impeller is so inexpensive at this Amazon site, but I'd act quickly.
Finish it with a GoKIt for a complete installation:

All for under $750.00.
 
Is this a circulation pump or a jet pump?

I think that the rule only applies to filtration pumps and not to jet pumps.

If you had multiple speeds, would you use the lower speeds?
 
JamesW said:
Is this a circulation pump or a jet pump?

I think that the rule only applies to filtration pumps and not to jet pumps.

If you had multiple speeds, would you use the lower speeds?
Click to expand...
Originally, yes, only filtration pumps were affected. With the DOE requirement change, it became all pumps, regardless of use. You can't get the shipped to California and suppliers don't carry them.
 
What about other pumps?

a. The following pumps do not have minimum performance requirements:

i. Waterfall pumps (1,800 rpm max).

ii. Filter pumps with integrated sand and cartridge filters (e.g., small inflatable pools).

iii. Rigid (permanent) and storeable (inflatable) electric spa pumps (e.g., pumps for hot tubs).

Are there any exemptions?

Three-phase pumps, electric spa (hot tub) pumps and pumps greater than 2.5 HHP (approximately 5 total horsepower [THP])
do not have minimum DPPP efficiency requirements.


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  • doe-faqs.pdf
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Seems like conflicting information.

The rules are so poorly written that virtually no one really understands the rules and everyone is mostly just guessing about what's what.

If it is a booster pump and you are only going to use it at high speed, it does not make sense to buy a variable speed motor.

WATER FEATURE AND SPA BOOSTER PUMPS
Pumps sold or marketed as water feature and spa booster pumps have all the physical attributes and performance characteristics of self-priming pool filter pumps are therefore classified as such and must comply with the minimum performance requirements of self-priming pumps (described in the two paragraphs above).

This regulation is not application specific.

PUMPS FOR STORABLE AND RIGID HOT TUBS

These pumps are not required to meet the new DOE performance or labeling requirements.

Loading…

www.pentair.com
 

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In my opinion, even the people who wrote the laws do not fully understand what the exact laws are.

So, you get a bunch of interpretations and assumptions.

I have tried several times to find the exact laws and I really cannot find any sort of clear explanation of exactly what is and is not covered.

It should be spelled out clearly with plenty of examples.
 

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“Dedicated-purpose pool pump” comprises self-priming pool filter pumps, non-self-priming pool filter pumps, waterfall pumps, pressure cleaner booster pumps, integral sand-filter pool pumps, integral-cartridge filter pool pumps, storable electric spa pumps, and rigid electric spa pumps.

“Replacement dedicated-purpose pool pump motor” means an electric motor that:
(A) is single-phase or polyphase;
(B) has a dedicated purpose pool pump motor total horsepower of less than or equal to 5 horsepower;
(C) is marketed for use as a replacement motor in self-priming pool filter pump, non-self-priming pool filter pump, or pressure cleaner booster pump applications; and

View Document - California Code of Regulations

govt.westlaw.com govt.westlaw.com

(B) Replacement dedicated-purpose pool pump motors with a dedicated-purpose pool pump motor total horsepower greater than or equal to 0.5 hp manufactured on or after July 19, 2021, shall be variable-speed replacement dedicated-purpose pool pump motors.

View Document - California Code of Regulations

govt.westlaw.com govt.westlaw.com

1710639447552.png

View Document - California Code of Regulations

govt.westlaw.com govt.westlaw.com

1710639538361.png

View Document - California Code of Regulations

govt.westlaw.com govt.westlaw.com

Browse - California Code of Regulations

govt.westlaw.com govt.westlaw.com

Browse - California Code of Regulations

govt.westlaw.com govt.westlaw.com
 
Ok, a little update. After a lot of research, apparently the WFE-8 motor is no longer available but the replacement motor for the WFE-8 is the B2843 and there are two styles.

The first is the type with the start capacitor on the top of the motor like my original WFE-8 (and the EBAY MOTOR I referenced before for $413.41), and the second type is THIS ONE for $100 less, but I'm assuming the start capacitor is located inside the motor, which shouldn't be an issue, right?

I contacted the seller of the first one ($413.41) about shipping to California but they never replied. However, the ad states that they ship to all 48 contiguous states, so I take that as a good sign. I also contacted the seller on the second motor ($295.95) and they replied almost instantly. Yes, they ship to California, and yes, it's $100 cheaper, but there's no warranty other than the optional ebay 2 year plan by Allstate, which is probably worth getting no matter which motor I get. As a side note, there's no warranty information on the $413.41 motor either (other than the Allstate optional 2 year warranty from ebay), so it probably doesn't come with a warranty either.

From what I can gather, both pumps are made in China (isn't everything nowadays), so that's another drawback, but I can't seem to find any B2843 motor that ISN'T!!

I also contacted a local motor supply company that James found for me, but they don't do repairs so it looks like I'll need to bite the bullet and buy a replacement motor, which is too bad since it's probably just a bad thermal limiter switch that's gone bad.

Oh, and by the way I also found out that the B2843 motor is used in multiple applications ranging from agriculture to HVAC to pools so that's why it's available in California.

So anyway, my dilemma is which motor to get? I'm leaning toward the $295 motor for two reasons. 1 - I'm a cheap SOB and 2 - I'm a poor SOB!

Suggestions are always welcome and appreciated!

Ed
 
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I didn't bother to ask. The guy that answered the phone was very surly. I asked him if they repaired motors and he said no, so I just said thank you and hung up. As a matter of fact, when he answered the phone he just said "yeah?"!!! No hello, no good morning, no niceties at all!

Ed
 
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