Wall Foam - Double layer? R Value?

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archjeb

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May 22, 2017
68
Portland/OR
Hi Folks,

Replacing our old AGP and because we heat it and evening temps can dip down; I'm thinking about double insulating the walls.
The old pool wall had a single layer of wall foam. Curious if anyone has tried to do a double layer? Or if there is some thicker versions out there that have a better R Value?
I cover the pool with a solar blanket to minimize heat loss; but sometimes the evening temps dip down enough that the heater is working overtime to maintain pool temp. So thus the investigation of either thicker wall foam or double layering it.

Thanks,

-J
 
Tough question. My gut would say it's not worth it as the ambient surface temps would have a big impact on the water temp, but I can't say for sure. I do know that if it gets very cold where you are at, most manufactures recommend not using the heater due to damage from condensation. Not sure if you knew that or it applies. Just depends on how cold your area and water gets.
 
I wouldn't double up on wall foam, but there is a 1/4" version. You can also look into Radiant or Optimum pools if you're replacing the whole thing, definitely thicker and one of their talking points is the insulation. Could also go with a bigger heater.
 
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Another option is the doughboy hydrosphere line- they claim enhanced energy efficiency with their thick walls. They are also the only doughboy that is saltwater approved if that’s important to you.
Really thick foam on the walls can make punctures more of a possibility so that is something to consider as well.
 
on the previous pool, even with the water at 88deg F, the wall really wasn't that warm to the touch on a cool night...so maybe the 1/8" single layer is doing its job.
I probably got more heat loss from the floor because I didn't have anything under the liner other than the gorilla Geotextile floor pad. So maybe on the next pool, if I put some foam on the floor...that might have a little better R value no?
I had a 12mil solar blanket to cover the top which seemed to insulate ok.
 
I have foam around my pool and judging by how the ice is behaving I don't think it's doing very much. The entire edge around the pool melts very fast on warmer days.
If it starts off at 1/8" it's certainly not going to be that after being compressed some by the water.

Even so, I think you're looking at R-0.4 at best. Hardly worth talking about even if the entire top surface wasn't exposed.
 
I added a single layer of wall foam when I changed my liner a few years ago and I don't think it does much. I didn't notice any change in heat retention. Also, insulation comes from the trapped air, and the pressure of the water in the pool really squashes the foam down. I doubt I am getting much insulation value from it.
 
The main point of foam for above ground walls or floors is cushion, smoother bottom & added protection for the liner, not really it’s insulating properties.
Buried pools retain temps much longer than pools with exposed walls.
For instance, My current above ground pool is buried on one side pretty deep & that seems to afford me a little more temperature retention than the non buried one i had before. My current pool takes a few days to cool down after the weather changes whereas my neighbor’s inground w/similar volume takes a week to be the same temp. My previous smaller above ground would be cold the next day after the weather dropped.
Stopping Heat loss through evaporation (by way of a cover) is really the main thing you can do in a steel thin walled above ground pool. Combining that with one of the other types of above ground pools mentioned above would be about as good as it gets with exposed walls.
They are a bit more pricey though. If you think u want wall/floor foam for some of the other benefits it can provide (like a smoother bottom & easier to diy), it definitely won’t hurt to use it. It just may not net the temp retention you’re hoping for.
 
Mdragger88 said:
The main point of foam for above ground walls or floors is cushion, smoother bottom & added protection for the liner, not really it’s insulating properties.
Buried pools retain temps much longer than pools with exposed walls.
For instance, My current above ground pool is buried on one side pretty deep & that seems to afford me a little more temperature retention than the non buried one i had before. My current pool takes a few days to cool down after the weather changes whereas my neighbor’s inground w/similar volume takes a week to be the same temp. My previous smaller above ground would be cold the next day after the weather dropped.
Stopping Heat loss through evaporation (by way of a cover) is really the main thing you can do in a steel thin walled above ground pool. Combining that with one of the other types of above ground pools mentioned above would be about as good as it gets with exposed walls.
They are a bit more pricey though. If you think u want wall/floor foam for some of the other benefits it can provide (like a smoother bottom & easier to diy), it definitely won’t hurt to use it. It just may not net the temp retention you’re hoping for.
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Or you could have the opposite happen as well. My friends had in in-ground liner pool. They had a very high water table, with some cold ground water. They would run their pool heater on the weekend, and as soon as they turned it off it would suck the heat right out of the pool.
 
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With an R value around 3, you're spitting in the ocean. Going to 6 won't matter, unlike going from standard r-30 to r-60 as is reccomended in cold weather attics.
 
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cj133 said:
0.4, R-3 would be an inch thick uncompressed.
Click to expand...
Lol. Yeah. I did a quick Google search and found one that was R3 and used it as the example. Maybe that one is compressed a good deal. But .4 proves the point even more. (y)

It's needed for a buffer between the uneven / rocky / rivet-y floor and wall. It serves next to no insulation benefits.

I learned this one researching garage doors and agonizing over the upcharge from a R5 - R-9. (?) When I asked my trusted neighbor he had me think it through (after he stopped laughing). Soon thereafter I was laughing too and ordered the cheaper one.

Some of the radiant/optimum walls are 1 inch foam insulation with resin on both sides like a sandwich. You'd see some benefit there, but evenso, they aren't performing any miracles either.
 
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