It is currently May 17th, 2012, 2:01 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]



 Page 1 of 1 [ 6 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Aqua Ammonia
PostPosted: April 20th, 2010, 6:07 am 
In the Industry

Joined: April 22nd, 2009, 6:35 am
Posts: 32
Have searched everywhere and cannot find any evidence that Aqua Ammonia (alone) kills algae. Anyone have any experience or knowledge about this?


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aqua Ammonia
PostPosted: April 20th, 2010, 6:10 am 
Special Contributor
Special Contributor

Joined: May 20th, 2007, 2:59 pm
Posts: 11039
Location: SWSuburban Chicago, IL
Straight to the Deep End, eh? :wink: :mrgreen:



_________________
TFP Moderator
Helpful links: Pool School; The Pool Calculator; CYA/Chlorine Chart
24' round AG pool, 52" high, Laars "lite 2" heater; Waterway 2 spd Pump;
150 Sq ft. Clearwater Cartridge Filter; Former and DISSATISFIED "Pool Frog" owner
NO LONGER FRUSTRATED thanks to TFP.com
www.PerfectlyClearPoolService.com
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aqua Ammonia
PostPosted: April 20th, 2010, 6:35 am 
Site Admin
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: May 7th, 2007, 3:03 pm
Posts: 23445
Location: Silver Spring, MD
Ammonia and chlorine tend to combine to form monochloramine, which kills algae. Monochloramine is not affected by CYA, so at high CYA levels the monochloramine is much more effective at attacking the algae than chlorine is. This process is most effective at relatively high PH, because that favors the formation of monochloramine over some of the other possible reaction products. Once the algae is killed, you will need to add lots more chlorine to get rid of the monochloramine.

We don't recommend this approach to killing algae for a couple of reasons, but it can be effective if used correctly.



_________________
19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
TFP Admin. Creator of The Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School
Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aqua Ammonia
PostPosted: April 20th, 2010, 4:20 pm 
In the Industry

Joined: April 22nd, 2009, 6:35 am
Posts: 32
JasonLion wrote:
Ammonia and chlorine tend to combine to form monochloramine, which kills algae. Monochloramine is not affected by CYA, so at high CYA levels the monochloramine is much more effective at attacking the algae than chlorine is. This process is most effective at relatively high PH, because that favors the formation of monochloramine over some of the other possible reaction products. Once the algae is killed, you will need to add lots more chlorine to get rid of the monochloramine.


Exactly, but I read somewhere that algae mistakes the monochloramine for food and consumes it. In the process, the compound breaks down into it's constituent chlorine and then the chlorine is what actually kills the algae. Can't remember where I read that though.



Any more thoughts or evidence.


Last edited by ETS on May 13th, 2010, 6:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aqua Ammonia
PostPosted: April 20th, 2010, 10:30 pm 
Registered User

Joined: April 20th, 2010, 3:30 pm
Posts: 61
Gold fish are well known for excreting a large amount of ammonia in their tanks.
Eventually the level gets high enough to kill the fish.
Yet when you see a high ammonia level in a fish tank you will frequently see much alge.
My experience with ammonia, as I am for sure not a pool expert, but has been that ammonia is used to prevent alge growth after the super kill is done. It prevents it well, from what I remember in the old chem days in school.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I also think that ammonia is what is used to kill black mold? but it has to be applied directly at full strength, and scrubbed???

Again I aint no expert, but I think ammonia alone wont get it,

Heck though, Im still trying to get what I have in good shape lol


Offline
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Aqua Ammonia
PostPosted: April 21st, 2010, 1:11 am 
Special Contributor
Special Contributor

Joined: March 28th, 2007, 2:40 pm
Posts: 5371
Location: San Rafael, CA USA
ETS wrote:
My opinion is like a fart in a hurricane against them. I am looking for evidence to prove them right. If I can't find any then they must be wrong.

Any more thoughts or evidence.

People who have very strong beliefs often ignore evidence to the contrary so they probably won't believe any of what I am about to tell you even though it's based on scientific peer-reviewed papers which I usually consider to be the best source for factual information.

This paper talks about ammonium ion uptake by red algae. This paper also talks about ammonium ion uptake (note that nitrate is another nitrogen form that is readily used by algae). This paper talks about ammonium ion uptake for algae, but this is marine algae (so sea water). This paper is another. Here is another. Temperature dependence for ammonium ion and nitrate ion uptake by bacteria and algae is described here. More marine algae uptake of ammonium ion here. Uptake in cyanobacteria here (also known as blue-green algae). More algae uptake. Algae blooms and ammonium uptake. I'm getting bored, aren't you?

Now for monochloramine. This article talks about it, but you have to pay to find out the details. This paper is free and talks about monochloramine killing green algae. This paper states that monochloramine (NH2Cl) is the most toxic substance that inhibits algal growth in chlorinated sewage effluent. There aren't as many scientific articles on this, but that doesn't make it less true -- it just makes it less interesting for investigation since people are more concerned with algae growth rates (for things like algal blooms in the ocean) than how quickly algae can be killed since it's not technically a pathogen.

Hope that helps,
Richard



_________________
16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
12 Fafco solar panels; Purex Triton PowerMax 250 natural gas heater (200,000 BTU/hr output); automatic electric pool safety cover; 4-wheel pressure-side "The Pool Cleaner"
Offline
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 Page 1 of 1 [ 6 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  


TroubleFreePool.com The Web